Author Topic: NCG + 1 HUGE MAP + 100 PLAYERS AT THE SAME TIME = IDEA FOR A NEW MOD  (Read 6621 times)

Marocco2

  • Posts: 159
Hi guys!

In the last days, I was playing Test Drive Unlimited 2. I was driving a Lancia when I hit a traffic light. Then I've thought:"How can TDU2 be if I put the damage model like in NCG?"

Today I'm sharing with you guys an idea to make NCG more social and funnier without destroy BugBear's work. Use NCG cars on an huge map (Ibiza is beautiful in TDU2) with over 100 players at the same time.

I think it's a great idea for a mod.

A lobby can be made with a central server with a good ping, then plug other servers around the world and sync. (I'll show you soon)
If a player don't have a good ping, other players share the data from the server to the bad pinged player.

Do you think is a good idea? Share your opinion below. Thanks :D

Majatek

  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1072
I don't think you realize just how insane the technical requirements would be.

It's not so much that it's impossible to have 100 players in a server (if it's a text-based game, 100 players on the same server would be a cinch to achieve without any slowdowns), it's that each client (player) would need to send and receive information about not only the client's car state, speed, rotational velocities, but also receive the car state, speed and rotational velocities of the cars of other clients. All 99 of them.

Realistically we can have around 24 cars in the same viewspace without massive slowdowns. Any more than that would be pushing it.

As neat an idea as it may sound, NCG's ROMU engine is just not designed for such a large-scale multiplayer environment.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2015, 08:48:03 AM by Majatek »
YouTube - Twitter



Having problems with purchasing NCG? Contact support@bugbear.fi

I moderate forums & break games

Marocco2

  • Posts: 159
Well, if players are around the map, why must a player receive the data from the player in the other side of the map?

I think a player could receive a data from the other player only if he's in the same zone of the map. So it will be laggy if there are 100 player in the same part of the map, which is statistically improbable.

Then the server must reset the zone every 30 minutes to avoid receive and send large data.

So, if the server is powerful, there won't be lag when 24 players are in the same area of the map.

Sent from my HP ElitePad 900 using Tapatalk

Lari Fari

  • Posts: 1747
If eighty of those players are far away, they don't add anything to my experience. ;-) SO I'd rather have 24 gathered close together and not 100 spread over a huge map :-)
Gaming Since 1989

Majatek

  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1072
Because in order for any car to look accurately deformed to every other player 100% of the time, the positions and collisions must always be simulated - otherwise something like this may happen:

Driver Bob sees Driver Jill. Jill is colliding her car against Driver Jack's vehicle. Driver Bob and Jack both see that Jill's and Jack's cars deform from the collision. Driver Bob and Jack then decide to hang out together while Jill decides to explore the far reaches of the map, and manages to get into a couple of accidents while on her trip. Jill comes back to where Bob and Jack are hanging out, and both Bob and Jack see that Jill's car did not change whatsoever because it was "out of range". To Jill, however, her car is a complete wreck, and she wonders how it can barely drive considering that on her end she can see that her car is bent like a banana and missing a wheel.

And this is only the beginning of the synchronization issues that you would have to battle against.
YouTube - Twitter



Having problems with purchasing NCG? Contact support@bugbear.fi

I moderate forums & break games

Marocco2

  • Posts: 159
Maybe NCG can handle more players. Only Update 6 can say that :)

Sent from my HP ElitePad 900 using Tapatalk

Majatek

  • *
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 1072
I'm not suggesting that NCG's ROMU engine can't handle more players. I'm stating that you'd need a supercomputer to not have terrible framerate due to the processing overhead requirement for simulating all those vehicles and all the subsequent collisions that could happen.
YouTube - Twitter



Having problems with purchasing NCG? Contact support@bugbear.fi

I moderate forums & break games

Marocco2

  • Posts: 159
Because in order for any car to look accurately deformed to every other player 100% of the time, the positions and collisions must always be simulated - otherwise something like this may happen:

Driver Bob sees Driver Jill. Jill is colliding her car against Driver Jack's vehicle. Driver Bob and Jack both see that Jill's and Jack's cars deform from the collision. Driver Bob and Jack then decide to hang out together while Jill decides to explore the far reaches of the map, and manages to get into a couple of accidents while on her trip. Jill comes back to where Bob and Jack are hanging out, and both Bob and Jack see that Jill's car did not change whatsoever because it was "out of range". To Jill, however, her car is a complete wreck, and she wonders how it can barely drive considering that on her end she can see that her car is bent like a banana and missing a wheel.

And this is only the beginning of the synchronization issues that you would have to battle against.

That is a good point. When Jill is far out, he's still talking to the server. When he meets Bob and Jack, the server provide to give vehicles stutus, damage etc. to Bob and Jack.

Usmovers_02

  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2102
Marocco, TDU2 is one of my favorite games of all time. I like it even more than I like Flatout and NCG. I think TDU could definitely benefit from NCGs damage model. However due to licensing issues TDU will never have a great damage model. A game like NCG can have crazy damage because they don't have to worry about licensing. Therefor a giant open map with NCGs damage model could totally work with maybe 8-24 players. That being said I just don't think this idea fits the organized racing theme that NCG is going for. I'd LOVE to see this in a different game though.

Also you suggested this be done as a mod. I don't think that's realistically possible. Building Ibiza cost Eden millions of dollars and an insane amount of time. For a modder to make a massive open level even a quarter the size of Ibiza would take an insane amount of time and they probably wouldn't have tools specifically designed for the game making it even harder. And then they'd have to make an online mode designed for this and that's no simple task. Possible for sure but not realistic for a modder.

You're idea is excellent but to me it just doesn't belong in NCG. Maybe a brand new IP :D

Marocco2

  • Posts: 159
Well, Vue is a great program to make 3d worlds at the size like Ibiza (I heard about a new Sony open source Map editor that it could help)

I know about license terms from Gran Turismo and this has Pros/Cons.

Thanks again for writing your opinions about this :)

Sent from my HP ElitePad 900 using Tapatalk

dbs213

  • *
  • Posts: 1566
Ehhhhh...not my thing. I love exploring huge environments but I'm not expecting to do it in this game, I'm more into that sort of FO1 style of free-roam. I don't really care about multiplayer as well since I'm always alone when I play games.
My Specs: Intel Core i7-4790 3.60GHz | 8GB Ram| Nvidia GeForce GTX 1060 6GB | Windows 7 Home Premium 64bit | 1TB Hard Drive
======================================
"Straight roads are for fast cars, turns are for fast drivers." - Colin McRae (1968 - 2007)

Marocco2

  • Posts: 159
Differences between standard server/client and p2p

Marocco2

  • Posts: 159
It's been a loong time. And I think it could be possible on a modded server.

Axarator

  • *
  • Posts: 372
Just moved the post to a more appropriate section.
OS: 64x Windows 7 Home Premium
Processor: Intel Core i4130 @ 3.40GHz 3.40GHz
Ram: 8Gb
HHD (Where Steam is installed): 2TB HHD
SSD(Where browser and poop is): 111GB
Graphics: ASUS GeForce GTX 960 OC Strix edition

Purple44

  • *
  • Posts: 8104
It's been a loong time. And I think it could be possible on a modded server.

Not going happen, Bugbear already said 24 players is hard coded into Wreckfest code into to many place to try and increase it by modding the game. Bugbear said it be a waste our time trying!!

Also you still would need a HUGE, fast pipe to handle that many cars a wrecking!!
« Last Edit: July 18, 2015, 02:49:51 PM by Axarator »
Flatout Joint, where the mods were.

i5 2500 i7 8700, 16GB, Nvidia 660 960 1060 6GB, Win 10 64bit, DFGT Wheel