Author Topic: My thoughts on this update today! Feb, 26th 16  (Read 8404 times)

Daystar

  • Posts: 2622
I love the fact that we have crews now, but I was wondering if there is a limit on how many crews we can have?



Also I am very impressed with the new handling of the cars, specially leaning around the corners at high speeds!
and so glad that the keyboard play dynamics have not been tampered in any way!

Oh! and the new track is really a blast to play on! great job Bugbear  :D I am very impressed with this release!!!
« Last Edit: February 26, 2016, 08:08:38 PM by Daystar »

Janne Suur-Näkki

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  • Posts: 1991
Thanks, glad you're enjoying the update!

As for the maximum number crews, I'm ashamed to admit that I don't actually remember what the limit is but there is one.

Daystar

  • Posts: 2622
Thanks, glad you're enjoying the update!

As for the maximum number crews, I'm ashamed to admit that I don't actually remember what the limit is but there is one.

That's not a problem Janne  :D

Have a great weekend!

Kepnik

  • Posts: 102
just wait another 2 weeks, then you will have enough of clicking about 50 times for changing parts, buying new
parts, you will realize that this game is 30-45% percent pain in the ass due to the repair system ( which
has NO USE AT ALL ).

youre right, I was rly impressed to at the beginning, but after half an hour clicking like a donkey
I realized that part wear has increased, and repair system is nothing but a big pain, no use.

Its such a huge joke, I cant believe it that these guys are treating the community like this.

Next thing I would love is that you have to do 200 rounds against KI to earn a driver
license for multiplayer...

Another Idea, what about if you have to upload a video where you put your dick into a mouse trap
to gain access to multiplayer ?

Or maybe the winner of every round gets banned from the server ?


All great Ideas if you love to piss the people of who made all this possible !!!
So just go on like this... Thanks for everything, OMG I am missing the buggy
Version from last year, it was not 50% of the version we have now but it
was about 5 times the fun, because I could just drive and have fun,
and there have been people playing...

Meanwhile most of the people are gone, and after 2-3 days the impact of this
update will be worse for the playing statistics, because Im sure most people
will feel  like me, that it must be a very very very funny joke...

But maybe tomorrow there is a new update without part wear and devs write "hahaha sorry guys just a joke"
That would be awesome, but I am waiting for this message for about 6 months now... so the time it was a
good joke is over now.

Daystar

  • Posts: 2622
Yep I have noticed this as well... the parts wear down way to fast! and I do admit, it is starting to annoy me quite a bit! grtrrr lol
but really glad Janne has mentioned that issue today. I am not so happy like you now, in regards to these speedy degradations.

Hopefully the game does not evolve into a clickfest type of game.. but I doubt it, granted that enough of us give input into this issue.
yeah  I thought it was cool at first I admit... but it grows on you after playing an hour or two.. after each race,  I had to go through
each parts menu, check it's condition, and either repair (if I had repair points) or buy a new part if available, which is about 30 to
40% the time. hell I have like 20 to 30 74% good condition parts in each section lol... so we all strive to have the best in parts
and with our current newer build.... err update, we will find ourselves more often in them parts screens. I must agree with you
it is really annoying me more so today I realize. so perhaps the community will start realizing this enough, and the current system
can be either tweaked better, or totally eliminated. I know they may have spent a few months for their efforts on this Crew concept
but maybe they can make it work better. or just have a totally different system employed... such as a simple repair all feature but at a
price. I know it's a bit of an arcadey approach, but it will greatly reduce the time spent in having to have to go though the hassle of fixing
almost everything after each race! thanks for bringing this up, I am finally realizing that this has begun to be a burden after almost every race!
 

Orbotnive T

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  • Posts: 486
Doubling the crew fix points awarded and reducing the wear to the old level would help. It's alright having the repair system but sometimes the countdown to next race goes to 30secs. And then getting into the menu, scanning everything and making the changes necessary after every race feels like a race in itself.

And I'd rather have time to scan what's degrading and fix in seperate races, give a bit more breathing room at least.

St. Jimmy

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  • Posts: 1465
Could be better that the wear is lower but the rewards are also lower? Also the game needs action based wear in and after the race.
I still haven't played this build so can't comment much.
All I can say that public lobby usually starts the next race way too fast and it's boring to have so much money and spare parts that it's the same if the part wear doesn't exist.
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Kepnik

  • Posts: 102
Hey Daystar,

thanks for your words, I hope more people start to talk out, otherwise I'm rly afraid
that I will stop playing this game. I think you could say it short, all the effort is good,
and maybe it will have a part in Multiplayer if the game is finished, I think its only
place will be single player...

BUT if there would be a great multiplayer carreer mode etc., no problem to implement a repair system.

In the current state of the game its just no use and stealing my time.

@Orbotnive, yeah youre right, that would at least be an improvment with the new build. Atm its worse than before, and it was already annoying ;-)
As said I think it would be way better without, part wear wont help forget missing content ;-) but for me the existing content always has
been enough, with the new build, car and track it could be so much fun to go on.

But instead I am just "alksdjalsdjsalkdj" about that I now use even more time clicking useless through the menu.


Purple44

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Yep I have noticed this as well... the parts wear down way to fast! and I do admit, it is starting to annoy me quite a bit! grtrrr lol
but really glad Janne has mentioned that issue today. I am not so happy like you now, in regards to these speedy degradations.

Hopefully the game does not evolve into a clickfest type of game.. but I doubt it, granted that enough of us give input into this issue.
yeah  I thought it was cool at first I admit... but it grows on you after playing an hour or two.. after each race,  I had to go through
each parts menu, check it's condition, and either repair (if I had repair points) or buy a new part if available, which is about 30 to
40% the time. hell I have like 20 to 30 74% good condition parts in each section lol... so we all strive to have the best in parts
and with our current newer build.... err update, we will find ourselves more often in them parts screens. I must agree with you
it is really annoying me more so today I realize. so perhaps the community will start realizing this enough, and the current system
can be either tweaked better, or totally eliminated. I know they may have spent a few months for their efforts on this Crew concept
but maybe they can make it work better. or just have a totally different system employed... such as a simple repair all feature but at a
price. I know it's a bit of an arcadey approach, but it will greatly reduce the time spent in having to have to go though the hassle of fixing
almost everything after each race! thanks for bringing this up, I am finally realizing that this has begun to be a burden after almost every race!

Daystar, if there was a non career mode for online and offline ( something like what we had in Build #6, can swap parts, but no wearing and repairing of parts ), then would you be OK having a repair system for those that want a career mode?

And that beg the question, do the players that do want a career mode, do they want the repair feature to be in Wreckfest?
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nickbrad

  • Posts: 15
I just registered here to give my views, up until now I have been vocal on the steam discussions with my praise for Wreckfest and shared how much I have enjoyed the racing....... until now.

My favourite car was the Euro 3, (Escort lookalike). It was twitchy on the limit like a Eurofighter, to get the best out of it you had to learn to feather the throttle in the turns and when you mastered it, you had a massive smile on your face, dodging the guys trying to take you out of the race. Now it handles like a front wheel drive, understeers constantly and forget trying to get the back end around, I am literally stomping on my accelerator pedal with no effect whatsoever. Also, I'm side slamming into guys all over and it's having about as much impact as it would if I was in the American 2.
I think I read somewhere that you were making it easier for keyboard drivers, what the hell were you thinking? Up until now, everything about the game showed you were headed in a more sim direction and leaving the arcade stuff behind, handling wise, now you've shafted everyone who has a wheel and pedals in favour of the casual gamer who isn't even interested enough to buy a cheap controller.
As for the brakes now, I have no idea what's going on, I genuinely thought my pedal was broke until I tried it on another racing game. The brakes are practically non existant now, unless you expect us to stamp on that as well.

The game is completely unplayable for me right now, please tell me that you are going to release a hotfix reverting the handling within the next 48 hrs or give me my money back. I expect more than 2 weeks of use from a game and I just cannot make any use of this at all in it's current state. I'm not going to waste my time coming last in every race to people playing on keyboards, spending way more for replacement parts than what I now earn each race, (down from approx 950 to 70 on comparable server sizes,) getting angry because it handles like a stuck pig.
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Daystar

  • Posts: 2622
Yep I have noticed this as well... the parts wear down way to fast! and I do admit, it is starting to annoy me quite a bit! grtrrr lol
but really glad Janne has mentioned that issue today. I am not so happy like you now, in regards to these speedy degradations.

Hopefully the game does not evolve into a clickfest type of game.. but I doubt it, granted that enough of us give input into this issue.
yeah  I thought it was cool at first I admit... but it grows on you after playing an hour or two.. after each race,  I had to go through
each parts menu, check it's condition, and either repair (if I had repair points) or buy a new part if available, which is about 30 to
40% the time. hell I have like 20 to 30 74% good condition parts in each section lol... so we all strive to have the best in parts
and with our current newer build.... err update, we will find ourselves more often in them parts screens. I must agree with you
it is really annoying me more so today I realize. so perhaps the community will start realizing this enough, and the current system
can be either tweaked better, or totally eliminated. I know they may have spent a few months for their efforts on this Crew concept
but maybe they can make it work better. or just have a totally different system employed... such as a simple repair all feature but at a
price. I know it's a bit of an arcadey approach, but it will greatly reduce the time spent in having to have to go though the hassle of fixing
almost everything after each race! thanks for bringing this up, I am finally realizing that this has begun to be a burden after almost every race!

Daystar, if there was a non career mode for online and offline ( something like what we had in Build #6, can swap parts, but no wearing and repairing of parts ), then would you be OK having a repair system for those that want a career mode?

And that beg the question, do the players that do want a career mode, do they want the repair feature to be in Wreckfest?

Hi Purple...

I am not really in favor of an online career mode... basically because some people have very poor internet speeds. such as me, when my wife's son is at home hammering our wifi.
but I do love playing online when I get the chance, which is not often. and about the repair system.. yeah I do not mind it, as long as it is done correctly. and not such a hassle as
described in my OP above.

and @Kepnik  Not a problem! I am just voicing my opinion about the crew  :) 

hande11

  • Posts: 203
My favourite car was the Euro 3, (Escort lookalike). It was twitchy on the limit like a Eurofighter, to get the best out of it you had to learn to feather the throttle in the turns and when you mastered it, you had a massive smile on your face, dodging the guys trying to take you out of the race. Now it handles like a front wheel drive, understeers constantly and forget trying to get the back end around, I am literally stomping on my accelerator pedal with no effect whatsoever. Also, I'm side slamming into guys all over and it's having about as much impact as it would if I was in the American 2.
I think I read somewhere that you were making it easier for keyboard drivers, what the hell were you thinking? Up until now, everything about the game showed you were headed in a more sim direction and leaving the arcade stuff behind, handling wise, now you've shafted everyone who has a wheel and pedals in favour of the casual gamer who isn't even interested enough to buy a cheap controller.
As for the brakes now, I have no idea what's going on, I genuinely thought my pedal was broke until I tried it on another racing game. The brakes are practically non existant now, unless you expect us to stamp on that as well.

The game is completely unplayable for me right now, please tell me that you are going to release a hotfix reverting the handling within the next 48 hrs or give me my money back. I expect more than 2 weeks of use from a game and I just cannot make any use of this at all in it's current state. I'm not going to waste my time coming last in every race to people playing on keyboards, spending way more for replacement parts than what I now earn each race, (down from approx 950 to 70 on comparable server sizes,) getting angry because it handles like a stuck pig.

That sounds to suck big time! Which wheel and pedals are you using? Good info for Devs and forum members to sort out and get it working correctly for next builds, hopefully soon! Have you had time to try if other than Euro car has currently this new issue, even if cars do behave differently?
Have not yet have time to get known repair system very well, but also it should absolutely not be so, that you cannot repair car, if you are getting at that moment many last positions and have shortage of money. Something for BB to fix?

Rauli reported FFB issues with Euro cars:
Just wanted to mention that the FFB isn't working with european cars properly (Im using DFGT). With american cars you can feel the force and it feels like driving, but with europeans it's just like turning the wheel without any response where the car is going. It's not this build only, the problem has been there for a while.

Hopefully good keyboard and wheel play won't be mutually exclusive! I think it's not anyone's objective and technically it should be very solveable.

Just to not dismiss any keyboard players (like one here), there are also very pro and enthusiastic keyboard players, that are for example using combined media tv/pc for playing (only pc they own, perhaps) and might even have very small living room area with no table where to screw driving wheel on, only small couch. In general, we should avoid  categorization of pro and non-pro gamers, because only of used hardware.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2016, 12:16:38 AM by hande11 »
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Janne Suur-Näkki

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  • Posts: 1991
Thanks for the input, everyone.

Actually, the cars are always tuned with a wheel and pedals, and only later when we're more or less happy about the setup we adjust the keyboard/gamepad controller accordingly, if necessary. In other words, the way the cars handle is never being compromised just to suit a keyboard or a gamepad player. In some cases we've actually had to implement new features to the keyboard/gamepad controller because of that, but it's the name of the game.

From what I gather from your post, nickbrad, you'd prefer the cars to oversteer. It is true that currently all the cars have a tendency to understeer unless there's enough torque to break free the backend. That said, have you tried the most powerful engine setup and a close ratio gearbox? It should make it easier to break the grip. Also try the racing tyres (on tarmac) to give more immediate steering response. We've put in considerable amount of effort while trying to get the cars to behave like real cars do, but after a certain point it becomes incredibly difficult to say what exactly it means. Remember that we don't have the resources to go on a real track to test some of these cars.

There seems to be a some sort of an issue with brakes of some cars, we'll look into it next week.

And as for the game turning into a clickfest, that was actually our main concern with the repair system too and it's definitely something that we want to avoid as well. I'm just not sure if adding a simple repair all button is a magic bullet, though. Wouldn't that render the whole repair system more or less superfluous? If we'd remove the repair system we'd have to come up with other ideas to give the game more depth and some motivation for the meta game, but of course we already have some ideas.

Purple44

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  • Posts: 8104

And as for the game turning into a clickfest, that was actually our main concern with the repair system too and it's definitely something that we want to avoid as well. I'm just not sure if adding a simple repair all button is a magic bullet, though. Wouldn't that render the whole repair system more or less superfluous? If we'd remove the repair system we'd have to come up with other ideas to give the game more depth and some motivation for the meta game, but of course we already have some ideas.

I would caution Bugbear on what voices to listen to the most when it come to career mode. Right now, we "all" are having to test the career mode and many of us have no interest in doing the career mode, especially online and just want to go back to a non career mode where there no degrading and repairing of parts, like me. So I will not comment on the career mode stuff. It online features that I have my eye on and Bugbear been doing a good job of getting online right.

It the players that like doing racing game career modes ( Flatout 1 and Grid 1 career modes are the only career modes I have ever finishes ), that I think should have more weigh to their comments on shaping Wreckfest career mode.

From the 3 years of reading the threads here in the forum, I think Bugbear does not want to do your plane run of the mill racing game career mode. Bugbear wants to do something different. I will we gladly let Bugbear take their shot at doing a career mode and let the serious career mode players here in the forum help shape it. Then when finally version of Wreckfest come out, I will give career mode a try and see if I can finish it before online racing with good players, pull me away. ( or try career mode in the beta if finish )

But with over a year of online racing with Wreckfest under my belt and another year yet to go before final version release, the pull of online should not be as strong as it was when Flatout 2 came out and I only made it half way through FO2 career mode before I never look back. For me, offline for a few weeks, online, if done right, is for many years!!
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nickbrad

  • Posts: 15
Thanks for the input, everyone.

Actually, the cars are always tuned with a wheel and pedals, and only later when we're more or less happy about the setup we adjust the keyboard/gamepad controller accordingly, if necessary. In other words, the way the cars handle is never being compromised just to suit a keyboard or a gamepad player. In some cases we've actually had to implement new features to the keyboard/gamepad controller because of that, but it's the name of the game.

From what I gather from your post, nickbrad, you'd prefer the cars to oversteer. It is true that currently all the cars have a tendency to understeer unless there's enough torque to break free the backend. That said, have you tried the most powerful engine setup and a close ratio gearbox? It should make it easier to break the grip. Also try the racing tyres (on tarmac) to give more immediate steering response. We've put in considerable amount of effort while trying to get the cars to behave like real cars do, but after a certain point it becomes incredibly difficult to say what exactly it means. Remember that we don't have the resources to go on a real track to test some of these cars.

There seems to be a some sort of an issue with brakes of some cars, we'll look into it next week.

And as for the game turning into a clickfest, that was actually our main concern with the repair system too and it's definitely something that we want to avoid as well. I'm just not sure if adding a simple repair all button is a magic bullet, though. Wouldn't that render the whole repair system more or less superfluous? If we'd remove the repair system we'd have to come up with other ideas to give the game more depth and some motivation for the meta game, but of course we already have some ideas.

Cheers for the reply Janne, I'm going to go about replying in a backwards fashion, in that i'll tackle the last point first.

I agree that a simple repair all button would be devastating and render all work up until this point irrelevant and you may as well remove wear all together.  I think the issue at the moment is the increased wear rate and the time required to replace/repair the parts, something that isn't an issue on single player, but multiplayer can be a big problem with new crews earning low repair points and some players not caring about wear at all, just preferring to click that ready button as soon as it's available.

I'm glad to hear that the wheel/pedal setup hasn't been compromised in this latest build as it gives us something we can work with. I do use racing parts throughout, (need some way to get ahead of the big, heavy American cars ;) ) but the racing tyres just don't seem to be working right, (on the Euro 3 at least). I did improve the situation by putting on my one remaining set of standard tyres, (the update took away approximately 20-25 sets I had saved up previously,) but I also changed the steering settings at the same time so I don't honestly know which is responsible and having a background in being part of multiple raceteams, I should know better than to play with multiple things at once, but i really was throwing a hail mary at the time.

Ultimately, yes, I do prefer the slightly more oversteer tendency of the previous build, in fact, once I got used to it, (took a couple of days,) I thought the handling was spot on, exactly how I'd expect a 30+ year old RWD Escort to feel. Sometimes I used to curse when tapped into a spin, but last night I was taking shots and gathering it up without even trying, it just didn't feel right anymore. When I switched to the AM2 though, the handling seemed completely at odds with my inputs and the FFb so strong I genuinely feared it was going to do some damage to my wrists if I didn't let go, (my right wrist does ache a little this morning still). I am reluctant to turn it down though as in the Euro 3, it is weaker and as that's usually my favourite car, I don't want to make that any less pleasurable to drive.
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