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Wreckfest => News => Topic started by: Janne Suur-Näkki on March 17, 2016, 03:43:48 PM

Title: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Janne Suur-Näkki on March 17, 2016, 03:43:48 PM
A hotfix for yesterday's update is now available with following improvements:

* Fixed particles.
* Reduced rough material reflectivity.
* Added stiff limited slip differentials.
* Added Asian 1 AI players.
* Improved Mixed 1 level art.
* Auto-repair can be previewed by hovering over the button.
* Added background blur effect to main menu.

Enjoy!
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: St. Jimmy on March 17, 2016, 03:49:18 PM
Did you remember to hotfix the Mudpit surface? I think it's too slippery even when it's suppose to be mud.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Lycanthropic Paranoia on March 17, 2016, 04:21:03 PM
The more slippery the better.  Although it would be nice to have an option to control how wet the surface is.  Also would be nice to control the size of the derby arena.  I like small arenas.  It's more challenging. 
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Showli2 on March 17, 2016, 04:26:36 PM
The problem is that the mud is too slippery to build up any speed, and the middle is completely useless because it's so bumpy. So you end up with slow hits, and if anybody is lucky, maybe 2 takedowns by the end of an 8-minute deathmatch. Additionally, the AI are hardly affected by the slipperyness.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: sam223 on March 17, 2016, 04:36:15 PM
Please have a look at what changed with the handling in february jannes. The cars feel like they are glued to to road. Especially on tarmac with EU/Asian cars,loads of understeer even with all assists off. Americans also feel like to much lateral grip imo.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: hande11 on March 17, 2016, 04:49:17 PM
Thanks BB for more frequent updates! :)

Btw, what are stiff limited slip differentials, what are we expecting for handling (google would tell, but others might have same question) ?  EDIT: maybe stiffer limited slip differential is more towards of a locked differential than open = increased traction for both rear wheels?
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: FollowWings on March 17, 2016, 05:38:04 PM
How fast fix! lav ya BugBear!! :) I hope youre well now Jenna! :)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Weymire on March 17, 2016, 05:40:43 PM
Just noticed that all cars in the main menu garage are slowly moving backwords. Left my computer for ~15 minutes and here's what happened:

https://youtu.be/WnYRZiLU2Gw
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: RickyB on March 17, 2016, 05:46:23 PM
Thanks! Any chance for a slider or some option to adjust the visual damage?

For the ones who like it a little bit over the top :) It feels as if sometimes almost nothing happens visually when crashing/bumping... especially when car is already dented, second hit doesn't do much more damage sometimes. sometimes there are rather hard crashes, but the damage looks rather modest compared to the impact speed. not always... but sometimes.

(http://i.imgur.com/KEJCbKW.jpg)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: WorldofBay on March 17, 2016, 05:55:32 PM
The problem is that the mud is too slippery to build up any speed, and the middle is completely useless because it's so bumpy. So you end up with slow hits, and if anybody is lucky, maybe 2 takedowns by the end of an 8-minute deathmatch. Additionally, the AI are hardly affected by the slipperyness.

that problem is on your side then. middle is not bumpy at all and spinning out happens rarely and expectedly to me, lot less than in flatout 1 on professional handling on second arena (the bumpy mud one). i was driving am1 with standard sus and locked diff, just the parts it already had. and i'm driving on keyboard. ended 10 minutes against AI first with 7:4 at first try after long abscense from this game.

for the first time in this game i consider mudpit a good derby arena now. it still is too big, especially with slippery surface, but now it feels good. could maybe be even more slippery.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: St. Jimmy on March 17, 2016, 07:04:50 PM
Please have a look at what changed with the handling in february jannes. The cars feel like they are glued to to road. Especially on tarmac with EU/Asian cars,loads of understeer even with all assists off. Americans also feel like to much lateral grip imo.
There's less understeer than in February so I'm not sure what you're talking about.


that problem is on your side then. middle is not bumpy at all and spinning out happens rarely and expectedly to me, lot less than in flatout 1 on professional handling on second arena (the bumpy mud one). i was driving am1 with standard sus and locked diff, just the parts it already had. and i'm driving on keyboard. ended 10 minutes against AI first with 7:4 at first try after long abscense from this game.

for the first time in this game i consider mudpit a good derby arena now. it still is too big, especially with slippery surface, but now it feels good. could maybe be even more slippery.
/EDIT:
You're maybe right. It's just more about the how you drive in that area. Need to be very gentle. Very different style of driving in there and it's good to have less power behind you.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: sam223 on March 17, 2016, 07:32:28 PM
@ ST.Jimmy: Its not changed since the tarmac 3 build.Been to much grip since then. Or barely changed since then anyway.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Purple44 on March 17, 2016, 11:38:21 PM
Just noticed that all cars in the main menu garage are slowly moving backwords. Left my computer for ~15 minutes and here's what happened:

https://youtu.be/WnYRZiLU2Gw

I saw that yesterday when I had forgot to close down Wreckfest for awhile ( maybe an hour or 2 ), but the Asian 1 stop at the back wall. Car did not fall into outer space.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Daystar on March 18, 2016, 12:09:29 AM
Janne thank you very much for this hotfix patch!

I find that the Asian AI do some hilarious mistakes, that makes for some rather interesting races!
 
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Purple44 on March 18, 2016, 12:58:54 AM
The problem is that the mud is too slippery to build up any speed, and the middle is completely useless because it's so bumpy. So you end up with slow hits, and if anybody is lucky, maybe 2 takedowns by the end of an 8-minute deathmatch. Additionally, the AI are hardly affected by the slipperyness.

that problem is on your side then. middle is not bumpy at all and spinning out happens rarely and expectedly to me, lot less than in flatout 1 on professional handling on second arena (the bumpy mud one). i was driving am1 with standard sus and locked diff, just the parts it already had. and i'm driving on keyboard. ended 10 minutes against AI first with 7:4 at first try after long abscense from this game.

for the first time in this game i consider mudpit a good derby arena now. it still is too big, especially with slippery surface, but now it feels good. could maybe be even more slippery.

I have done deathmatches online with Mud pit many times. So I just gave the mud pit a go with my usually car, the Muscle 4 with standard parts and mud pit definitely more slippery and harder to get up too ramming speed with my DFGT wheel and no assists.

Then I put the rally tires on, made big difference. Mud still on the slippery side, which it should be, but I could still get going and get some speed on. Mud pit with rally tires feels right to me. I would not want Bugbear to change it. :)

Edit: This test was done with a B class brand new Mus 4 ( all standard parts ). Car did not have any racing parts to make it a A class car. Would a powerful A class car be spinning the tires more than a B class car?

I would like to check this out, but don't have the time right now. Maybe tonight I can. Could a B class car be the better car in a mud pit?
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Purple44 on March 18, 2016, 01:05:40 PM
The problem is that the mud is too slippery to build up any speed, and the middle is completely useless because it's so bumpy. So you end up with slow hits, and if anybody is lucky, maybe 2 takedowns by the end of an 8-minute deathmatch. Additionally, the AI are hardly affected by the slipperyness.

that problem is on your side then. middle is not bumpy at all and spinning out happens rarely and expectedly to me, lot less than in flatout 1 on professional handling on second arena (the bumpy mud one). i was driving am1 with standard sus and locked diff, just the parts it already had. and i'm driving on keyboard. ended 10 minutes against AI first with 7:4 at first try after long abscense from this game.

for the first time in this game i consider mudpit a good derby arena now. it still is too big, especially with slippery surface, but now it feels good. could maybe be even more slippery.

I have done deathmatches online with Mud pit many times. So I just gave the mud pit a go with my usually car, the Muscle 4 with standard parts and mud pit definitely more slippery and harder to get up too ramming speed with my DFGT wheel and no assists.

Then I put the rally tires on, made big difference. Mud still on the slippery side, which it should be, but I could still get going and get some speed on. Mud pit with rally tires feels right to me. I would not want Bugbear to change it. :)

Edit: This test was done with a B class brand new Mus 4 ( all standard parts ). Car did not have any racing parts to make it a A class car. Would a powerful A class car be spinning the tires more than a B class car?

I would like to check this out, but don't have the time right now. Maybe tonight I can. Could a B class car be the better car in a mud pit?

Just got done testing a Muscle 4 - A class car with rally tires and then bought a new B class Muscle 4 and put rally tires on.

The A class ( 206 ) car took much longer to get speed up into the 40+ MPH. Switch to the B class ( 155 ) and it was much easier to get up to 40+ MPH ramming speed.

If looking for a realistic mud derby, look like Bugbear getting close. Where Mo? What he think?

Now I did not pay much attention to the AI to see if they were having much trouble with the mud. But out of 4 last man standing derbys I just did, I won 3 of them against the AI. Last one I went out early.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: WorldofBay on March 18, 2016, 04:37:39 PM
the problem there is you don't see what part AI uses. i had a yellow american4 that had a lot of trouble, spun a lot and all and on the other side there were stable ones. is AI now using all parts randomly?
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: hande11 on March 18, 2016, 09:35:27 PM
For (too) slippery mud pit.. If one is not using pedals, or maybe even with pedals: how would Accelerator Sensitivity -setting play out? Put this setting to more of a plus side, it will give you "pedal to the metal" -effect (rear tires spinning fast without grip). If you put it to minus side, it will gently increase the gas and keep better grip in slippery mud?

Have to try this track out too :)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: sam223 on March 18, 2016, 11:42:07 PM
For (too) slippery mud pit.. If one is not using pedals, or maybe even with pedals: how would Accelerator Sensitivity -setting play out? Put this setting to more of a plus side, it will give you "pedal to the metal" -effect (rear tires spinning fast without grip). If you put it to minus side, it will gently increase the gas and keep better grip in slippery mud?

Have to try this track out too :)
It doesn't work like that. Positive is fast at the start of depress,smoother at the end of depress,similar to a short pedal height.Negative is the opposite,which would give a feeling similar to a worn clutch,slow pickup speed at the start. It wouldn't give you more grip,just more control over the pedal if you were driving in heavy boots for example.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Mopower on March 19, 2016, 08:44:35 AM
The mudpit still seeems like you have a lot of traction within the first 3-4 mph, and then once you gain car speed you have very little. The lawn mower derby is just about right now, I like the handling on that track for a dirty track.

Mudpit should be similar, but a little more slip.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: hande11 on March 19, 2016, 10:40:38 AM
For (too) slippery mud pit.. If one is not using pedals, or maybe even with pedals: how would Accelerator Sensitivity -setting play out? Put this setting to more of a plus side, it will give you "pedal to the metal" -effect (rear tires spinning fast without grip). If you put it to minus side, it will gently increase the gas and keep better grip in slippery mud?

Have to try this track out too :)
It doesn't work like that. Positive is fast at the start of depress,smoother at the end of depress,similar to a short pedal height.Negative is the opposite,which would give a feeling similar to a worn clutch,slow pickup speed at the start. It wouldn't give you more grip,just more control over the pedal if you were driving in heavy boots for example.
Ah true, it's curved response. I stand corrected. Was thinking a scenario, that you are stopped or moving slow speed in slippery mud and apply throttle, it could cause rear tires to spin too fast and slip instantly if you have this setting too much on positive side. Negative setting could give less tire spinning in the beginning and help you pick up some speed first.. This setting did not have noticeable effect *with keyboard* when i tested AM1 (standard tires), rear tires are spinning on both end of the setting, especially when you try to get car moving from zero speed upwards. And that should happen often, so just an observation. I like slippery surfaces a lot, more the driving challenge, the better.
When you get moving in certain speed, say over 40 mph, mudpit caused spinning with very slight turning attempts. But have to say, here keyboard is showing weakness. It's too all-on / all-off on this surface. Also very wet and thick mud, has some randomness in it, that should suprise driver now and then, so all sorts of increased spinning suprises in wet mud are ok in my books.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: sam223 on March 19, 2016, 01:04:10 PM
For (too) slippery mud pit.. If one is not using pedals, or maybe even with pedals: how would Accelerator Sensitivity -setting play out? Put this setting to more of a plus side, it will give you "pedal to the metal" -effect (rear tires spinning fast without grip). If you put it to minus side, it will gently increase the gas and keep better grip in slippery mud?

Have to try this track out too :)
It doesn't work like that. Positive is fast at the start of depress,smoother at the end of depress,similar to a short pedal height.Negative is the opposite,which would give a feeling similar to a worn clutch,slow pickup speed at the start. It wouldn't give you more grip,just more control over the pedal if you were driving in heavy boots for example.
Ah true, it's curved response. I stand corrected. Was thinking a scenario, that you are stopped or moving slow speed in slippery mud and apply throttle, it could cause rear tires to spin too fast and slip instantly if you have this setting too much on positive side. Negative setting could give less tire spinning in the beginning and help you pick up some speed first.. This setting did not have noticeable effect *with keyboard* when i tested AM1 (standard tires), rear tires are spinning on both end of the setting, especially when you try to get car moving from zero speed upwards. And that should happen often, so just an observation. I like slippery surfaces a lot, more the driving challenge, the better.
When you get moving in certain speed, say over 40 mph, mudpit caused spinning with very slight turning attempts. But have to say, here keyboard is showing weakness. It's too all-on / all-off on this surface. Also very wet and thick mud, has some randomness in it, that should suprise driver now and then, so all sorts of increased spinning suprises in wet mud are ok in my books.

Thats what i thought you were trying to achieve. Its one of the reasons why keyboard inputs should probably be discredited from handling/physics feedback imo. You fix something for keyboard players,you dumb it down for everyone else  (unless you specifically design aids for keyboard players aswell). Try a longer final gear ratio on the top end engines (high revs = most torque),or use the 4 speed box rather than 6 speed,or set off in 2nd gear all the time. For the v8s you are probably always going to be hindered due to high torque at low revs.

As mopower said though,its pretty easy to set off,you just start to lose grip once the revs/speed get up. So maybe just go from 2nd to 5th and then blip the throttle?
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: hande11 on March 19, 2016, 01:54:52 PM
For (too) slippery mud pit.. If one is not using pedals, or maybe even with pedals: how would Accelerator Sensitivity -setting play out? Put this setting to more of a plus side, it will give you "pedal to the metal" -effect (rear tires spinning fast without grip). If you put it to minus side, it will gently increase the gas and keep better grip in slippery mud?

Have to try this track out too :)
It doesn't work like that. Positive is fast at the start of depress,smoother at the end of depress,similar to a short pedal height.Negative is the opposite,which would give a feeling similar to a worn clutch,slow pickup speed at the start. It wouldn't give you more grip,just more control over the pedal if you were driving in heavy boots for example.
Ah true, it's curved response. I stand corrected. Was thinking a scenario, that you are stopped or moving slow speed in slippery mud and apply throttle, it could cause rear tires to spin too fast and slip instantly if you have this setting too much on positive side. Negative setting could give less tire spinning in the beginning and help you pick up some speed first.. This setting did not have noticeable effect *with keyboard* when i tested AM1 (standard tires), rear tires are spinning on both end of the setting, especially when you try to get car moving from zero speed upwards. And that should happen often, so just an observation. I like slippery surfaces a lot, more the driving challenge, the better.
When you get moving in certain speed, say over 40 mph, mudpit caused spinning with very slight turning attempts. But have to say, here keyboard is showing weakness. It's too all-on / all-off on this surface. Also very wet and thick mud, has some randomness in it, that should suprise driver now and then, so all sorts of increased spinning suprises in wet mud are ok in my books.

Thats what i thought you were trying to achieve. Its one of the reasons why keyboard inputs should probably be discredited from handling/physics feedback imo. You fix something for keyboard players,you dumb it down for everyone else  (unless you specifically design aids for keyboard players aswell). Try a longer final gear ratio on the top end engines (high revs = most torque),or use the 4 speed box rather than 6 speed,or set off in 2nd gear all the time. For the v8s you are probably always going to be hindered due to high torque at low revs.

As mopower said though,its pretty easy to set off,you just start to lose grip once the revs/speed get up. So maybe just go from 2nd to 5th and then blip the throttle?
Oh yes, true, using gearing like you said must be best way to improve mudpit driving, good advice! I only used automatic gearing to test it. Ofc i have to stongly disagree as kb player for discrediting kb handling part, but there could be more wheel users on die hard players, having most playing hours. So even ok to prioritize Wheel handling efforts over keyboard, if necessary. But maybe both can be supported, i think BB indicated, they tweak separately all controllers, hope it's reality. Approx. 30% for poll seemed to use kb, not sure about actual numbers. But agree with you that WF is best experienced with wheel as are all not-fully-arcade driving games (i'm dreaming to have wheel, once i solve small flat + furniture-where-to-attach wheel problem.. playing Wreckfest with media-center pc currently).
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: sam223 on March 19, 2016, 02:10:27 PM
^ The reasoning for my comment is that they have to test it for all inputs and then hinder each input with hidden aids (like the slow steering speed seen on pads but not on keyboards). And you end up with feedback that driving is crap on a certain input,then tweak for that input and make it bad for other inputs.

Its better imo to setup the game for wheels (realistic input) and not what 30% are using (keyboards). Then add aids which can be tweaked by the players so you can use any input. If we use steering for example. Pads and keyboards and hindered by lack of control over degrees of rotation vs the wheel. Its a lot of testing to test all inputs,when instead you could implement a maximum degrees of lock in the options instead which could be used by all inputs.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: hande11 on March 19, 2016, 02:25:11 PM
Yes, i kind of agree with you. Edited my previous message already a bit when having second thought. I'm ok as keyboard player for wheel controllers to have most attention, since these gamers probably have most die-hard hours with the game. Have to admit, i'm not so deep understanding controller integration currently with driving physics. If tweaking is separate and very isolated, then why not to pre-fine tune each major controller type by BB, but if tweaking keyboard will overlap to wheel handling and vice versa, i understand dilemma this causes. It would be nice if driving physics would be universal, and only controller integration can be edited and separated from it, but this could not be case, since handling for wheels apparently changed lately.  Another area is competitive racing and whether you can powerslide faster track than not (as powersliding should give slower lap times).

p.s. and it sure is frustrating, if handling is changing every other build and getting steps back, so understanding dissatisfaction getting base level handling changed  constantly. Some suggested to going back to couple of builds back to fix wheel handling, i think we would need BB guy to comment on that here and change history..
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Finsku on March 19, 2016, 04:25:19 PM
There's still areas on finish line area where's invisible objects where cars could hit and which breaks cars a little bit. Example Tarmac 1, Sandpit (can't remember which, longer faster and with 2 dif. layouts) has car breaking spots.  :(
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: freddy on March 19, 2016, 04:56:53 PM
I kinda like this build now:

- repair all button better, just put it in lobby
- ability to switch manually in automatic is good, although i drive manual now  >:(
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: findRED on March 20, 2016, 06:49:20 AM
While I do enjoy the hotfix, It still leaves some bugs and annoyances untouched.

First and Foremost the Pad Bug!
This little thing is starting to really bug me (no pun intended), so if no one else has done it, I will post it on the bug section sometime in the next 7 days or so. (it takes time to gather the data because real life stuff comes first)  And so you know, it is more than just cameras changing in hard cornering situations, it is also (in some cases) an instant disconnect-reconnect with the controller (and yes the disconnect windows sound plays every time it happens).

With the biggest grip out of the way.... comes the second biggest grip which is game-breaking!  I name it the "feel no input bug"
I am not sure if it is still the "jump into cement" bug purple has posted before, or a new one, but now I cannot race on any remotely hilly track do to an effect much like the cement one purple mentioned is still in the build!
EDIT:  Does NOT seem to be related to the cement bug.

SNIP

But going off the high jump on gravel track, I'm seeing the same problem I had with Feb Build #10 and the Muscle 4 car having cement in the truck. Same thing happening with the Asian 1 car. This bug not fix yet.  :(
(http://www.lay-zmattress.com/flatout2/purple44/Next%20Car%20Game%202016/cement-trunk.jpg)
(http://www.lay-zmattress.com/flatout2/purple44/Next%20Car%20Game%202016/cement-trunk2.jpg)

Maybe it is related to using a pad instead (I don't think it is IT IS), but any time I lose tire contact (air from jumps and bumps mainly, sometimes from ai hits) It acts like I have stopped inputs with my pad! (I have yet to test with keyboard... Have tested with keyboard, is only a pad issue.)  This one is slightly more complicated to explain without a video or picture, but it kills the fun and overall driving feel!  It's terrible especially on the Gravel track!

Relating to both of the bugs, I tried a lawnmower derby on the lawnmower derby track....  Anytime I would go over the center hill with enough speed to catch the slightest of air, I would experience the "feel no input bug"!  On top of that, I also noticed a substantial increase in the frequency of my pad disconnect sounds relating to the pad bug whenever I was turning!
I know I should post this one as well in the bug section if it is not already, but at this point in development these two bugs are all that's holding back an amazing game imho!  If it weren't for the frustration I get from these two bugs, I would be all over the forums screaming about how awesome this update is!

And for all the positives I have given previously for this build, it only takes 2 annoying bugs to wreck an amazing game.
EDIT:  The two bugs are both pad bugs, and I use almost exclusively a pad!  I will be posting both in a single bug report if I cannot fix them using the usual steps...

Now, since I don't want to make anymore new threads and posts tonite, I must type out just a few last words about a needed fixing/adjustment....

The 5 speed transmission for American 3 (The Olds 442 look-alike):
(*disclaimer, all ratios assume "raito:1" so an example:  1.10:1 is the current fourth gear I am talking about*)
The fourth gear in this tranny is just off!  It needs to be changed from the current 1.10 ratio to a much more sensible 1.00 ratio.  This is my only grip with this car, otherwise the American 3 is, and has been since it was introduced, my most favorite car in Wreckfest!  I tune my pad sensitivity to controlling this car!  I am currently running it with the bigblock, race intake/carbs and sport exhaust/headers to the tune of a high B class.  I only run the 5spd manual with no assists, and generally a lsd or locked differential.  And, yes a 1.00 fourth gear ratio is very much in line with many American cars and transmissions from the muscle car era to the 80s.  Even the aftermarket uses the 4th gear as a 1.00 ratio to base their 5 & 6 speed overdrive transmissions on.  And the American 3 has such a short jump from 3rd to 4th with the 5spd, that it makes a lot of sense to change the 4th gear to a 1.00 ratio.  The 5th gear is quite sufficient as an overdrive with a 0.82 ratio.
Now, for balancing purposes, you may want to adjust the 6 spd so the 5th and 6th gears are both overdrive gears (which is more consistent with American 6spd racing transmissions too) and leave the 4th gear as either a 1.00 or very near to it (like a 1.10).  The 5th gear can be a slight overdrive like a 0.94 with the 6th being a 0.80 or so.



Wow, I said a lot more than I though I was going to.... Well, No tl;dr for you!  If you want to know what I said, read it, otherwise just ignore it.
I made my main thought bold and large so you can't miss it!
EDIT:  Added info on bugs, ruled out keyboard in second bug.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Purple44 on March 20, 2016, 11:25:09 AM
Red, I did not see what pad you are using. Also are you using a 3rd party program to get your pad to work in Wreckfest? Or does Wreckfest recognize your pad no problem?
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: rhamm on March 20, 2016, 04:51:04 PM
Is auto repair suppose to do the bare minimum to get the cars running and driving correctly?  If so then it works as designed but it seems kinda weird that I can repair my car and things are only fixed a certain percentage but I still have plenty of money left to go buy brand new parts.  Would be nice if the game had a repair wizard that let you choose levels of auto repair, including buying new parts.

The worst part of the cement bug is when your suspension gets down to 3 dots or less of health.  The first crash in this video I didn't mind as it kinda seemed realistic at the time but the second one is a bit over the top.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eb4kF6DwKqc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eb4kF6DwKqc)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: St. Jimmy on March 20, 2016, 09:09:43 PM
Is auto repair suppose to do the bare minimum to get the cars running and driving correctly?  If so then it works as designed but it seems kinda weird that I can repair my car and things are only fixed a certain percentage but I still have plenty of money left to go buy brand new parts.  Would be nice if the game had a repair wizard that let you choose levels of auto repair, including buying new parts.

The worst part of the cement bug is when your suspension gets down to 3 dots or less of health.  The first crash in this video I didn't mind as it kinda seemed realistic at the time but the second one is a bit over the top.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eb4kF6DwKqc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eb4kF6DwKqc)
It depends how you analyze that. I'd say it's not a problem with suspension, it's a problem with deform and how much impact makes your car fly like crazy.
On that second jump your front right is bend downward.

One way to "solve" this issue is to make the suspension act like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5mlsA-2aSM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5mlsA-2aSM)

But that ain't fun either. And the same thing could still happen if your car is bend downward so it just moves the problem forward. So only real ways to fix this is that downward bending is fixed and the force that a bottom hit makes should be lowered. BugBear knows the issue and they've said that it's very hard to solve so we'll see what happens in the future.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: hande11 on March 21, 2016, 12:29:22 PM
Is auto repair suppose to do the bare minimum to get the cars running and driving correctly?  If so then it works as designed but it seems kinda weird that I can repair my car and things are only fixed a certain percentage but I still have plenty of money left to go buy brand new parts.  Would be nice if the game had a repair wizard that let you choose levels of auto repair, including buying new parts.

The worst part of the cement bug is when your suspension gets down to 3 dots or less of health.  The first crash in this video I didn't mind as it kinda seemed realistic at the time but the second one is a bit over the top.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eb4kF6DwKqc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eb4kF6DwKqc)

Havent experienced cement bug yet, but it looks pretty bad physics (especially that bounce effect) on second jump as you said.  AM1 seems to go always down with rear first, in many cases it should go front first as front-engine car? If Bugbear could tweak car going front first, it would be nice too see how current physics play out then. Here one good vid about stock -car jumps at 50 secs mark. It's although with less jump speed:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asyVhJKwFQU&feature=youtu.be&t=50s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asyVhJKwFQU&feature=youtu.be&t=50s)

There seems to be own science of physics again in stunt jumps.   :)
"..acceleration, not just speed, is key to setting up your car for a correct airborne trajectory. "If you're accelerating on takeoff, the front end will rise," he explains. "And if you're decelerating on takeoff, the front end will drop."
http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/a6017/how-to-jump-a-stunt-car-like-travis-pastrana/ (http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/a6017/how-to-jump-a-stunt-car-like-travis-pastrana/)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Purple44 on March 21, 2016, 02:03:06 PM
Yup that video show, the part of car that has the engine, should be coming down first if car is airborne for awhile.

This cement in the trunk effect was not a problem until Feb Build #10 release. Now if I'm driving the mini Euro, I would expect the backend to drop first.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: WorldofBay on March 21, 2016, 02:47:53 PM
There seems to be own science of physics again in stunt jumps.   :)
"..acceleration, not just speed, is key to setting up your car for a correct airborne trajectory. "If you're accelerating on takeoff, the front end will rise," he explains. "And if you're decelerating on takeoff, the front end will drop."

if you accelerate, inertia will push everything backwards in relation to the wheels. suspension absorps it by letting the back go down and front go up. that's normal car physics and the reason why many jumps should not be driven fullspeed but with a little release before the peak to get the nose down. braking on oppsite makes inertia push your car forward, pushing front down and end up.

if you time it right you get your car spinning a little and that is stronger than weight distribution. braking/releasing in the right moment makes you land nose down even with engine in the rear.

also if you remember, weight has no effect on acceleration of gravity, only difference is drag which is fought better with high weight through - again - inertia. so the effect of weight distribution inside an object only comes to sight at long airtime.

then there is another effect which is that you leave the ground with front first, so the front has little time to fall down while the rear is still blocked by ground and so gives a momentum to the car eventually going for a front flip.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: hande11 on March 21, 2016, 03:13:02 PM
if you time it right you get your car spinning a little and that is stronger than weight distribution. braking/releasing in the right moment makes you land nose down even with engine in the rear.

also if you remember, weight has no effect on acceleration of gravity, only difference is drag which is fought better with high weight through - again - inertia. so the effect of weight distribution inside an object only comes to sight at long airtime.

then there is another effect which is that you leave the ground with front first, so the front has little time to fall down while the rear is still blocked by ground and so gives a momentum to the car eventually going for a front flip.

Excellent info and points WorldofBay. So not in all scenarios should front end come down first even with front engine, depends on many factors. Would be nice to have couple of horizontally level jump ramps to test this .. i only drove off in huge cliff edge in Sandpit 1 and it still seemed fell rear end first hah, but that is kind of bad test case.

And in Rhamm's 2nd jump, for that strange bounce effect, St jimmy and rhamm had already good suspect: (weared) suspension not able to take the hit in landing, and then car damage physics kick-in and will make car bounce funny.. hopefully something BB could fix with not too much effort..
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: FollowWings on March 21, 2016, 03:44:52 PM
Quote
https://youtu.be/asyVhJKwFQU

The roof is bended more as I can see in this video except the game has now, but its a little thingy, more important is that what is mentioned below! :)

By the way, someone from the Developers already mentioned the physics of the car has, or had that time, what is more like a ball with tweaked car physics,
or correct me if you know it better!
Need a test map with ramp to help them out tweak or fix it more! ;-)
I think there is one at the "mods" section!
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: WorldofBay on March 21, 2016, 11:02:12 PM
...

Excellent info and points WorldofBay. So not in all scenarios should front end come down first even with front engine, depends on many factors. Would be nice to have couple of horizontally level jump ramps to test this .. i only drove off in huge cliff edge in Sandpit 1 and it still seemed fell rear end first hah, but that is kind of bad test case.

And in Rhamm's 2nd jump, for that strange bounce effect, St jimmy and rhamm had already good suspect: (weared) suspension not able to take the hit in landing, and then car damage physics kick-in and will make car bounce funny.. hopefully something BB could fix with not too much effort..

depends also on ramp angle, a steep ramp makes you more likely to land with rear first, while a even "ramp" puts your nose down.

looking at the video the front goes a bit too far up in my opinion.
the landing with rear first is uncontrollable. main reason why you shouldn't go fullspeed straight. tip for finish straight: go full left before jump and jump to the right, that effectively softens the ramp and smoothens the landing, makes full-speed possible, though it's not markably faster than just releasing especially since you land at brake point.

looking at the second jump, that should break your front suspension, really hard landing. that bouncing off looks odd, in my opinion it should rather make the rear go right and then start to flip sideways (with lots of parts flying around obviously), that would not only look more realistic but also more spectacular.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: findRED on April 06, 2016, 03:55:20 AM
All of my ranting about 2 pad bugs in this thread is for NOTHING...  I WAS WRONG.

In my testing, as my pad setup is SCP Drivers for a DS3 controller, I found out my problem (which was prevalent in other racing titles like GRID 1) was PURELY HARDWARE RELATED.
Yeah, shocking!

I am sorry for ranting at you Bugbear for something not even related to your company or games.

Now about that hardware problem?  What caused it? you ask...
My front usb 2.0 ports on my computer.  Either the 2 usb ports on my case are bad, or (more likely) my usb headder on my motherboard doesn't support high enough speed/is bad, or (somewhat likely) I don't have it configured properly in the bios to allow full speed to those front usb 2.0 ports.
(I am now using the rear usb 2.0 ports for my ds3 controller as they work flawlessly!)

Either way, I am sorry community for venting my frustration at you and anyone else who visits these forums.  At the time of my original post I was fed up with the "bug" as it broke all play-ability on most tracks for me, and had just read some gloomy predictions on these forums about Bugbear running out of money, and not being able to finish Wreckfest.
In no way does my frustrations excuse my outburst.

I also ask you forgive me for this unneeded outburst about a problem that was hardware related on my end.
Thank You
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Facial_Burns on April 06, 2016, 04:15:51 AM
All of my ranting about 2 pad bugs in this thread is for NOTHING...  I WAS WRONG.

In my testing, as my pad setup is SCP Drivers for a DS3 controller, I found out my problem (which was prevalent in other racing titles like GRID 1) was PURELY HARDWARE RELATED.
Yeah, shocking!

I am sorry for ranting at you Bugbear for something not even related to your company or games.

Now about that hardware problem?  What caused it? you ask...
My front usb 2.0 ports on my computer.  Either the 2 usb ports on my case are bad, or (more likely) my usb headder on my motherboard doesn't support high enough speed/is bad, or (somewhat likely) I don't have it configured properly in the bios to allow full speed to those front usb 2.0 ports.
(I am now using the rear usb 2.0 ports for my ds3 controller as they work flawlessly!)

Either way, I am sorry community for venting my frustration at you and anyone else who visits these forums.  At the time of my original post I was fed up with the "bug" as it broke all play-ability on most tracks for me, and had just read some gloomy predictions on these forums about Bugbear running out of money, and not being able to finish Wreckfest.
In no way does my frustrations excuse my outburst.

I also ask you forgive me for this unneeded outburst about a problem that was hardware related on my end.
Thank You

The fact u even had to balls to stand up and say you were wrong is amazing most others just wouldn't have said anything further on the matter hoping no one would question them further on their issue
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Dillinja187 on April 06, 2016, 06:06:28 PM
All of my ranting about 2 pad bugs in this thread is for NOTHING...  I WAS WRONG.

In my testing, as my pad setup is SCP Drivers for a DS3 controller, I found out my problem (which was prevalent in other racing titles like GRID 1) was PURELY HARDWARE RELATED.
Yeah, shocking!

I am sorry for ranting at you Bugbear for something not even related to your company or games.

Now about that hardware problem?  What caused it? you ask...
My front usb 2.0 ports on my computer.  Either the 2 usb ports on my case are bad, or (more likely) my usb headder on my motherboard doesn't support high enough speed/is bad, or (somewhat likely) I don't have it configured properly in the bios to allow full speed to those front usb 2.0 ports.
(I am now using the rear usb 2.0 ports for my ds3 controller as they work flawlessly!)

Either way, I am sorry community for venting my frustration at you and anyone else who visits these forums.  At the time of my original post I was fed up with the "bug" as it broke all play-ability on most tracks for me, and had just read some gloomy predictions on these forums about Bugbear running out of money, and not being able to finish Wreckfest.
In no way does my frustrations excuse my outburst.

I also ask you forgive me for this unneeded outburst about a problem that was hardware related on my end.
Thank You

Always takes a bigger man, well in FindRED :)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Purple44 on April 11, 2016, 04:40:41 PM
Bugbear uploaded a new Build for testing today:  https://steamdb.info/app/228380/history/

Does that mean we might see a new Build release sometime this week? 
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: DD-Indeed on April 11, 2016, 04:46:16 PM
Bugbear uploaded a new Build for testing today:  https://steamdb.info/app/228380/history/

Does that mean we might see a new Build release sometime this week?


Quite confident about that. Beginning to feel restless... :P
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Antsaboy on April 12, 2016, 04:15:54 PM
Another new build just 2 hours ago  ;) https://steamdb.info/app/228380/history/
The tension is getting higher, maybe this week...
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: CrashsTestsFr on April 14, 2016, 04:56:22 PM
Two more updates today  :D
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Adziej on April 14, 2016, 05:59:52 PM
Seems that Bugbear wants to announce a bankruptcy soon:
http://asiakastieto.fi/pdf/konkurssilista.pdf (http://asiakastieto.fi/pdf/konkurssilista.pdf)
What do you guys think about it?
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: CrashsTestsFr on April 14, 2016, 06:16:36 PM
Seems that Bugbear wants to announce a bankruptcy soon:
http://asiakastieto.fi/pdf/konkurssilista.pdf (http://asiakastieto.fi/pdf/konkurssilista.pdf)
What do you guys think about it?

(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/04/11/article-2602528-1D06B2D200000578-424_634x471.jpg)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Facial_Burns on April 14, 2016, 07:07:20 PM
Seems that Bugbear wants to announce a bankruptcy soon:
http://asiakastieto.fi/pdf/konkurssilista.pdf (http://asiakastieto.fi/pdf/konkurssilista.pdf)
What do you guys think about it?

http://community.bugbeargames.com/index.php/topic,8733.msg83574/topicseen.html#new (http://community.bugbeargames.com/index.php/topic,8733.msg83574/topicseen.html#new)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: Adziej on April 14, 2016, 07:16:21 PM
Oh, I didn't check general discussion section, sorry then.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: OutLoud on March 18, 2017, 11:21:32 AM
I tried to report these 2 porn spam posts above (which have hopefully been removed when most people read this), but after entering a comment and clicking "submit", the browser just loads forever (latest Firefox). Just FYI.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: The Very End on March 18, 2017, 11:44:20 AM
The reports do get through, even tho the browser stops.
But ffs, fix your security allready BB. Make captcha's or whatever when register to fix the issues.
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: RickyB on March 18, 2017, 01:46:54 PM
Damn, I really got excited for a few seconds as I saw the recent forum posts and thought there was an update yesterday... then realised - topic was from 2016.   :D ??? ::)

(https://img.memesuper.com/c96305b42667e732acd6fd6b756cb720_u0sb1ajpg-meme-doh_788-500.jpeg)
Title: Re: Hotfix 2016-03-17
Post by: basti4655 on March 18, 2017, 03:38:32 PM
Damn, I really got excited for a few seconds as I saw the recent forum posts and thought there was an update yesterday... then realised - topic was from 2016.   :D ??? ::)

(https://img.memesuper.com/c96305b42667e732acd6fd6b756cb720_u0sb1ajpg-meme-doh_788-500.jpeg)

Same here xD