Is there ANY reason to play Flatout 3?

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Eurotrash

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Frisker said:
I got no idea what you're talking about buddy... They want it to be "Flatout 1 realistic". It was semi realistic regarding physics and vehicle handling, and that they want to experience again with new hardware.
Yeah well FO1 wasn't realistic, so make up your mind.

Frisker said:
And the nitro matter is pretty much discussed already, freedrive, maybe could fit, maybe not, depends on how it's done but imo it wouldn't be needed in derby game. Livery creator - well that's something I'd love. I could finally create my frisking ride ;D
Car upgrades aren't really needed ether. Hell more cars and tracks aren't really needed ether. Does their absence prevent you from playing the game? No. But they will still be added. Why? Cause a game with a handful of tracks, cars and gamemodes ain't worth 50$ or whatever the asking price will be once it's out.

Frisker said:
And Euro, I really have nothing against you, I'd love to be friends with everyone but seriously, you seem bit too ignorant pretty much all the time. You attack every opinion harsly if it's not agreeing with you, and if you want something, you wont stop until you get it. And that's a skill too, learn to stop asking for something when clearly majority is against it, especially without any proper arguments.
If I were to put you in the same corner as the others right now that would make you a hypocrite. So far the best argument they've been able to come up with for pretty much everything was "it doesn't fit in the game".
 

Usmovers_02

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Eurotrash said:
Frisker said:
I got no idea what you're talking about buddy... They want it to be "Flatout 1 realistic". It was semi realistic regarding physics and vehicle handling, and that they want to experience again with new hardware.
Yeah well FO1 wasn't realistic, so make up your mind.
Pretend for a second that you're a fan of sim racers. There are only 2 racing games of any type in the entire world: GRID and Burnout. Which one are you going to choose? You're going to choose GRID because next to Burnout it's a sim. That doesn't mean it IS a simulator though. Codemasters goal with GRID is to give the player an experience that feels real but is still easily accessible for quick fun. That's pretty much the same with FO1. Of course it isn't a sim but next to 90% of the other racing games out there it pretty much is. Even FO: UC is more realistic in the handling department than most arcade racers.

Eurotrash said:
Frisker said:
And Euro, I really have nothing against you, I'd love to be friends with everyone but seriously, you seem bit too ignorant pretty much all the time. You attack every opinion harsly if it's not agreeing with you, and if you want something, you wont stop until you get it. And that's a skill too, learn to stop asking for something when clearly majority is against it, especially without any proper arguments.
If I were to put you in the same corner as the others right now that would make you a hypocrite. So far the best argument they've been able to come up with for pretty much everything was "it doesn't fit in the game".
What you fail to realize is that "it doesn't fit the game" is a legitimate reason. Imagine if Forza or GT added a Mario Kart style track with crazy jumps and cartoony graphics. Could it be fun to drive simulation level cars on a cartoon track? Yes, absolutely. Does it really make sense in such a game? No.
 

Eurotrash

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Usmovers_02 said:
Pretend for a second that you're a fan of sim racers. There are only 2 racing games of any type in the entire world: GRID and Burnout. Which one are you going to choose? You're going to choose GRID because next to Burnout it's a sim. That doesn't mean it IS a simulator though. Codemasters goal with GRID is to give the player an experience that feels real but is still easily accessible for quick fun. That's pretty much the same with FO1. Of course it isn't a sim but next to 90% of the other racing games out there it pretty much is. Even FO: UC is more realistic in the handling department than most arcade racers.
True. Which makes me wonder why people hate FO2 and FO:UC so much. It's far from an arcade racer (or a total arcade racer, whatever, I only use that term cause it's popular) and they have everything their predecessor had plus more.

Even if FO2's handling is game-breaking, why dismiss all the other stuff?

"It doesn't fit the theme" is simply another way of saying "I don't like this stuff and I don't want other people to have it ether".

Usmovers_02 said:
What you fail to realize is that "it doesn't fit the game" is a legitimate reason.Imagine if Forza or GT added a Mario Kart style track with crazy jumps and cartoony graphics. Could it be fun to drive simulation level cars on a cartoon track? Yes, absolutely. Does it really make sense in such a game? No.
It would make those games less painfully boring, yes. But what YOU fail to realize is that nitro, sports cars, crazy jumps and all the other stuff already existed in Flatout, so adding them into Next Car Game and adding Mario Kart stuff to Gran Turismo are very different things.
 

Ozozer

I am bad at English
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Eurotrash said:
Frisker said:
Say what? No one has said that they want this to be utterly realistic.. And with that "everything remotely creative or interesting doesn't fit into the game or isn't realistic" - you're talking about the nitro again, aren't you?
No they just said they want it to be 99% realistic.
Don't you speak on behalf of others.
 

Usmovers_02

Active Member
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Eurotrash said:
Usmovers_02 said:
Pretend for a second that you're a fan of sim racers. There are only 2 racing games of any type in the entire world: GRID and Burnout. Which one are you going to choose? You're going to choose GRID because next to Burnout it's a sim. That doesn't mean it IS a simulator though. Codemasters goal with GRID is to give the player an experience that feels real but is still easily accessible for quick fun. That's pretty much the same with FO1. Of course it isn't a sim but next to 90% of the other racing games out there it pretty much is. Even FO: UC is more realistic in the handling department than most arcade racers.
True. Which makes me wonder why people hate FO2 and FO:UC so much. It's far from an arcade racer (or a total arcade racer, whatever, I only use that term cause it's popular) and they have everything their predecessor had plus more.
You only speak in extremes don't you? I can't recall a single instance of someone on this forum saying they hate FO2/UC. I know there are plenty of people who prefer FO1 but there are also plenty who prefer FO2/UC... myself included.


Eurotrash said:
Usmovers_02 said:
What you fail to realize is that "it doesn't fit the game" is a legitimate reason.Imagine if Forza or GT added a Mario Kart style track with crazy jumps and cartoony graphics. Could it be fun to drive simulation level cars on a cartoon track? Yes, absolutely. Does it really make sense in such a game? No.
It would make those games less painfully boring, yes. But what YOU fail to realize is that nitro, sports cars, crazy jumps and all the other stuff already existed in Flatout, so adding them into Next Car Game and adding Mario Kart stuff to Gran Turismo are very different things.
They may be painfully boring to you but to people like me they are not. If you don't like the game then obviously don't buy it. There's no need to make a game appeal to everybody. It's impossible anyways. But I don't think that's what you're saying.

Also, I've never spoken out against nitro, sports cars or jumps. Quite the contrary. I hope all 3 make the cut. Obviously my Mario Kart example was extreme but the point remains the same. Things like GTA level free roam do not fit this game (and BB isn't making the game free roam so arguing about this particular feature is pointless). I've seen plenty of other ideas thrown around too that might be fine in other games but not in NCG.
 

Eurotrash

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Usmovers_02 said:
You only speak in extremes don't you? I can't recall a single instance of someone on this forum saying they hate FO2/UC. I know there are plenty of people who prefer FO1 but there are also plenty who prefer FO2/UC... myself included.
Well then sorry for putting you in their group.

Usmovers_02 said:
They may be painfully boring to you but to people like me they are not. If you don't like the game then obviously don't buy it. There's no need to make a game appeal to everybody. It's impossible anyways. But I don't think that's what you're saying.

Also, I've never spoken out against nitro, sports cars or jumps. Quite the contrary. I hope all 3 make the cut. Obviously my Mario Kart example was extreme but the point remains the same. Things like GTA level free roam do not fit this game (and BB isn't making the game free roam so arguing about this particular feature is pointless). I've seen plenty of other ideas thrown around too that might be fine in other games but not in NCG.
Again, sorry for putting you in that corner.

Anyway, Bugbear might not add that but that doesn't mean it wouldn't fit in the game. Free roam doesn't affect the theme of any game. What you think that if Next Car Game would feature it it would stop being a demo derby game? It would simply be a demo derby game that doesn't shackle you to the track, which would add up to your precious realism...
 

Usmovers_02

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It's all good. Nobody is perfect. I'm certainly not. Regarding having a full blown open world where you had to travel between events: I honestly wouldn't have backed the game if they had decided to go this route. I'm sure it would be a fine game even with open world but open world destroyed the Burnout formula for me too. Sure, BO: Paradise is a great game but it's not a great Burnout game. I want a proper Burnout 5 and I want a proper Flatout 3. I'd very probably buy a game that played similarly to FO/NCG in an open world. I just don't want that game to have anything to do with the FO franchise.
 

Eurotrash

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Usmovers_02 said:
It's all good. Nobody is perfect. I'm certainly not. Regarding having a full blown open world where you had to travel between events: I honestly wouldn't have backed the game if they had decided to go this route. I'm sure it would be a fine game even with open world but open world destroyed the Burnout formula for me too. Sure, BO: Paradise is a great game but it's not a great Burnout game. I want a proper Burnout 5 and I want a proper Flatout 3. I'd very probably buy a game that played similarly to FO/NCG in an open world. I just don't want that game to have anything to do with the FO franchise.
Don't know why you think that. It could use more rural landscape but apart from that Paradise City seems to have everything it needs...

Imagine if the current tracks from FO UC were exactly the same, but instead of the game resetting you once you went off-track, you could ether reset the car to the last on-track position (like in Flatout 1) or you could just keep going, maybe find new roads from other tracks, etc... would that be game breaking?
 

Usmovers_02

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There's a difference between open tracks and open world. I'm completely fine with the infield of a track being open to the player. To me open world means you have to drive between events GTA style.

The racing in Paradise is definitely very similar to past BO game. But crash mode... removing that and calling the game Burnout was inexcusable to me (yes, I know BO 1 didn't have crash mode). I definitely know that keeping the feature set the same between games results in stagnation. For an instance Bioshock 2 is practically the same exact game as #1. That means the gameplay is just as good, the environment is still atmospheric and the story made sense in the Bioshock world. But for me the game wasn't nearly as brilliant as B1 simply BECAUSE it was just more B1. But then Bioshock Infinite changed a TON about the franchise while keeping the core intact and the game was brilliant.

So yeah, the FO franchise also has to evolve and that does mean making pretty big changes. I just see open world and weaponized cars going completely against the core theme. (we're way off topic but this is too entertaining)
 

Eurotrash

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Usmovers_02 said:
There's a difference between open tracks and open world. I'm completely fine with the infield of a track being open to the player. To me open world means you have to drive between events GTA style.
Open-world means exctly what it says: open world. Has nothing to do with missions, drugs, hookers, guns, more guns, whatever.

But fine, yeah what I was talking about were open tracks, like in Project Torque.

Usmovers_02 said:
So yeah, the FO franchise also has to evolve and that does mean making pretty big changes. I just see open world and weaponized cars going completely against the core theme. (we're way off topic but this is too entertaining)
Weaponized cars? Sure, though it would still be cool to have as an optional game-mode. But free roam doesn't affect the theme. Hell even Forza has free roam now, does that make it any less Forza?
 

Frisker

Active Member
Weeked Smasher
Eurotrash said:
Usmovers_02 said:
There's a difference between open tracks and open world. I'm completely fine with the infield of a track being open to the player. To me open world means you have to drive between events GTA style.
Open-world means exctly what it says: open world. Has nothing to do with missions, drugs, hookers, guns, more guns, whatever.

But fine, yeah what I was talking about were open tracks, like in Project Torque.

Usmovers_02 said:
So yeah, the FO franchise also has to evolve and that does mean making pretty big changes. I just see open world and weaponized cars going completely against the core theme. (we're way off topic but this is too entertaining)
Weaponized cars? Sure, though it would still be cool to have as an optional game-mode. But free roam doesn't affect the theme. Hell even Forza has free roam now, does that make it any less Forza?
Where you got the hookers and drugs and all that stuff? No one was talking about them.. he obviously meant that there is huge difference with open world, and open tracks, open world means that the whole gameworld would be accessible all the time, and so you could travel from one track to another withing the same session, without loading times. Like if there is one track set in summer, in west coast in US, and one winter track in northern Canada. Would be pretty big map then.. But if there is only open track areas, (Which I think you mean), then you could freely drive around that area and I got nothing against it. Similar style Flatout 1 had.
 

Usmovers_02

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Frisker said:
Where you got the hookers and drugs and all that stuff? No one was talking about them.. he obviously meant that there is huge difference with open world, and open tracks, open world means that the whole gameworld would be accessible all the time, and so you could travel from one track to another withing the same session, without loading times. Like if there is one track set in summer, in west coast in US, and one winter track in northern Canada. Would be pretty big map then.. But if there is only open track areas, (Which I think you mean), then you could freely drive around that area and I got nothing against it. Similar style Flatout 1 had.
Thank you Frisker, that's exactly what I meant. (also, I think you meant to write "she obviously meant" ;) )

Eurotrash, Forza does not have free roam. The spinoff Horizon does but not the main franchise. The spinoff isn't even a simulator.
 

Serenya

Member
Weeked Smasher
Usmovers_02 said:
Frisker said:
Where you got the hookers and drugs and all that stuff? No one was talking about them.. he obviously meant that there is huge difference with open world, and open tracks, open world means that the whole gameworld would be accessible all the time, and so you could travel from one track to another withing the same session, without loading times. Like if there is one track set in summer, in west coast in US, and one winter track in northern Canada. Would be pretty big map then.. But if there is only open track areas, (Which I think you mean), then you could freely drive around that area and I got nothing against it. Similar style Flatout 1 had.
Thank you Frisker, that's exactly what I meant. (also, I think you meant to write "she obviously meant" ;) )

Eurotrash, Forza does not have free roam. The spinoff Horizon does but not the main franchise. The spinoff isn't even a simulator.
One big annoyance in English language is just the lack of a unisex personal pronoun, which I usually find would be handy in many situations. Though in Finnish we only have the unisex one, so sometimes it's also a problem. :D

But about the free roam, I remember some of the devs said somewhere that there will very likely be a reset like in FO1 to make it possible to explore the map, but no any real open world has mentioned by them. I guess the Sneak Peek will remain as the only "open world" version. :p
 

Usmovers_02

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And thats exactly what I want to see. In pretty much every game I play sometimes I just want to explore outside the boundaries of the level. My cousin and I managed to break out of almost every single level in Halo 3 :D
 

Serenya

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Weeked Smasher
Hmm, doesn't the current Early Access built have a reset like that? I haven't been playing it for a while thanks to my poor graphics performance, but that's what I remember so probably it will stay as is to the final release. :)
 

Frisker

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Yeah, I meant "she". I hate english for that... in Finnish we only have "hän", and that works for boys and girls!
 

Eurotrash

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Frisker said:
Where you got the hookers and drugs and all that stuff? No one was talking about them.. he obviously meant that there is huge difference with open world, and open tracks, open world means that the whole gameworld would be accessible all the time, and so you could travel from one track to another withing the same session, without loading times. Like if there is one track set in summer, in west coast in US, and one winter track in northern Canada.
Umm... not really. By your logic, Test Drive Unlimited 2 is an open-track game, and not an open world game...

Anyway he was talking about GTA-specific elements, the missions.

Frisker said:
Would be pretty big map then.. But if there is only open track areas, (Which I think you mean), then you could freely drive around that area and I got nothing against it. Similar style Flatout 1 had.
Yeah that's what I meant all along.

Usmovers_02 said:
Eurotrash, Forza does not have free roam. The spinoff Horizon does but not the main franchise. The spinoff isn't even a simulator.
I seem to recall:

Usmovers_02 said:
Pretend for a second that you're a fan of sim racers. There are only 2 racing games of any type in the entire world: GRID and Burnout. Which one are you going to choose? You're going to choose GRID because next to Burnout it's a sim. That doesn't mean it IS a simulator though. Codemasters goal with GRID is to give the player an experience that feels real but is still easily accessible for quick fun. That's pretty much the same with FO1. Of course it isn't a sim but next to 90% of the other racing games out there it pretty much is. Even FO: UC is more realistic in the handling department than most arcade racers.
Anyway that's not the point, I'm not gonna debate on how realistic Horizon is since there is no such thing as a perfect simulator.
 

Frisker

Active Member
Weeked Smasher
TDU 2 has only Hawajian islands.. it doesn't contain any snow tracks or anything, as it's only the specific location, thus it can be called open world game.

But as NCG will most likely have events all over US, or even the world, it cannot really be called open world or it would have pretty damn big map to travel from Texas to Alaska(If one location is in Alaska and one in Texas), get my point?
 

Serenya

Member
Weeked Smasher
Frisker said:
TDU 2 has only Hawajian islands.. it doesn't contain any snow tracks or anything, as it's only the specific location, thus it can be called open world game.

But as NCG will most likely have events all over US, or even the world, it cannot really be called open world or it would have pretty damn big map to travel from Texas to Alaska(If one location is in Alaska and one in Texas), get my point?
Actually just Oahu from the first TDU was Hawaiian, the new Ibiza is Spanish... :D And they actually aren't in the same dimension in the game, you need to fly to another island and this is like changing the track in a non-open world game like FO for example - the both islands aren't loaded at once. But of course that doesn't make TDU2 a non-open world game, just a silly little notion. ;)
 
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