The state of the game for 2021. Is it relevant?

METE0R

Member
In this thread I will try to describe the state and relevance of the game as objectively as possible, I hope the developers will have food for thought, but this is more hope than a possible future. To date, the game remains in a playable form, but this is only a playable form, which is still very far from quality. The game is gradually starting to degrade due to the fact that the technical part of the game remains the same as it was in the beta.
The main problems are the outdated interface, the absence of such chips as a quick change of the car class (presets), the soundtrack needs to be changed too (but focusing on the old one), the official vanilla servers should be added (because the lack of a full-fledged multiplayer rejects the potential audience of the game), long tracks such as the Nurburgring (with good advertising, such an innovation will attract new players to the game), the game also needs a Racing AI (Skill Bot) that will teach players to drive a car (the problem with players who cannot play is very relevant now), the game is unpolished to a presentable state (each improvement must have its own icon and be memorable, and this will revive the discussions among players who betray the appearance of the car), the balance of the game is currently being lost due to the addition of Super Venom and Raiden RS. There are 2 items left and I do not know which one to add to this list, this is career and multiplayer. I don’t know what to blame the game for, because I don’t understand what it focuses on. The multiplayer is at the level of FlatOut 1, a 2004 game, and the career is terribly monotonous and absolutely nothing has happened to it since the release, and such questions have a detrimental effect on the interest of the game from the players.
Also, not all the bugs in my bug reports have been fixed, and this makes me sad. Now I ask you to forgive that I dared to encroach on the sacred, I just expressed what I see from the angle of the critic who came to try the game. It is still in its raw form and requires serious improvements. Of course, I have no right to tell the developers how to make the game, they know better, of course, but a lot of people agree with me what it means, I am not crazy and the game really needs serious work.
The game, of course, has strengths that pull the game out of the abyss of minuses, these are realistic damage, cars that look cool and each with their own character, well-made tracks, fine-tuning of each car, tournaments that make the game reachable (but the game should have something will allow you to spend extra fame, because it is simply not used, and many players play for the sake of progress, and not for the result in the race), also the good side is that the developers partially listen to the players (although they do not do everything they want), and the last plus it is support for mods that can dilute the game well. As a critic I would bet 6/10, as a fan who grew up playing BB games the hand won't go below 8/10. That's all I wanted to tell you, maybe someone will find it useful.
 

Cegon

Member
I'm happy to see someone make a post like this. Often I find myself holding back criticism because I don't want to be seen as the grumpy old man who always finds something to make a fuss about. In reality I'm seriously passionate about Wreckfest and I want the game to be long term succesful.


Tracks

You mentioned long tracks, something like the Nürburgring might be too much since it's about 22 kilometers, I think the upper limit is about 2.5 kilometers to keep the cars closer together on a 24 slot server (Sandstone Main and Alt Route is both roughly 2.5 kilometers each). That being said I 100% agree on longer tracks.

The tracks that have been added recently, most have either one or the other thing in common. One thing is being a simple oval which gets boring after a very short time, the other thing is they induce random crashes (Wrecknado, Eagle's Peak...) because of intersections or multidirectional sections with oncoming traffic. Even Hillstreet Circuit is designed in a way that the leading cars that exit the "loop" at low speed get punted by the cars that enter the "loop" at high speed. The wasted potential of Hillstreet Circuit is that it is missing a variant without the intersection. Otherwise it is a great track and I love how the road surface has reduced grip compared to, let's say, the pristine tarmac of Espedalen Raceway.

Tracks with intersections that induce chaos are great for new players but, from my observation, as soon as a player reaches a certain skill level, that player then prefers calculated punting to benefit their position over random crashing that randomises everyone's position in the race. Long-term players are the ones who buy Season Passes and use their own hardware or money to set up public servers.


Career / Tutorial for new players

Personally I like the idea of incentivising new players to play some form of career mode to have access to more cars, but I completely understand that my opinion is outdated and most players want to jump into multiplayer right away. Something I noticed with this type of player is that they neither understand building a car for the PP cap of a particular class, nor the meaning behind the suspension / gear ratio / differential / brake balance sliders -- and I don't blame them! That stuff is difficult to understand for non-petrolheads.

What if, somewhere in the main menu, there was a text box saying "we have tutorial videos for setting up your car on our official website!" (and matching videos on said website)?


Balance

The Raiden RS sticks out like a sore thumb because it can do ridiculous laptimes while being cartoonishly easy to drive, solid as a rock and also you basically can't spin or push it. The Super Venom is less problematic since the only thing it does exceptionally well is laptimes. Compare both these cars to the Starbeast SS which is brand new but, as of now, even worse than the regular Starbeast because it has peak torque and power higher in the rev range without having, let's say, an extra gear to compensate for it. Anyway, the game needs a re-balance.

If a part of Wreckfest's business model relies on selling DLC cars, those cars should be relevant in multiplayer.


Advertising DLC cars

In the "Market" menu where you buy vehicles, there should be previews for DLC vehicles and a text box that explains how to get them. The Loaner cars players drive during Tournament challenges should be DLC vehicles so players get to see for themselves that the DLCs are worth the money. I'd even go so far to say each DLC vehicle should have a 30 second trailer that shows different paintjobs and armor setups.

Car dealerships sell cars because they have cars on display and they offer test drives.
 

Purple44

Well-Known Member
Team Bugbear Member
..... I don’t know what to blame the game for, because I don’t understand what it focuses on. The multiplayer is at the level of FlatOut 1, a 2004 game, ......
How can you say that Wreckfest is at the level of Flatout 1????????

I was there in 2005 when I got my Flatout 1 US version. There was no online for Flatout 1, but there was LAN mode players could use. Euro v1.1 did not have text chat in the lobby. US v1.2 had a 3 line text chat.

It took modders to come up with programs to take Flatout online so players from around the world could race Flatout 1 online. This what the guys at Flatout Joint did tapping into the LAN code:



We added a nice chat window and some host options like random track.




Here what a Flatout 1 US v1.2 host options and lobby look like: ( had get out my Flatout 1 disk to get these 2 pics )





Flatout 1: Only 8 players, only up to 10 laps
Wreckfest: 24 player lobbys, 60 lap race if you want.





Took this pick today:




Things you can do in Wreckfest host options:

Edit server message in real time after you in the lobby, can use colored text
Can do team races and derbys
Can pick the weather
Can turn reset off or up to a 20 sec delay ( I fought for at least a 5 sec delay reset before Bugbear gave us this reset option )
There a reverse limiter for them Clean or semi-Clean servers ( I use to race Flatout 1 clean with bunch of Euro guys, hi Drunkfin )

Things you can do in a Wreckfest lobby.

Can upgrade your car or change the paint on your car skin ( this got added last year )
Can tune your car for the track your on next
Can go to Settings and tweak your steering sensitivity if you going to race with the sofa car ( -50 )
Can scroll the text chat window, if you miss what was posted while you was racing or changing your car
Can add bots to the server, if there not enough real players to have some fun with. Watch out for my evil twin!

Wreckfest server list:

Can now set a server you like, to be a favorite and show at top of list ( yellow star ). Very helpful when there a list of 576 servers!
Or use the Filter to narrow list to only servers with a player in it
Or use the Friends tab, to see what server your friends are in. :)

****************************************************************

So Meteor, I have to strongly disagree with you about comparing current Wreckfest with Flatout 1. Now Flatout 2 online was not bad for back in 2006. But all 3 Flatouts, 1, 2 and UC, we only had 8 players online. We got blown away when Bugbear gave us 18 players online back in Oct 2014 and then got updated to 24 player. :O



I been here since the summer 2012 and when Bugbear said they were working on their "Next Car Game", I did a thread to help Bugbear from doing online badly like we seen other racing games do and improve on what Bugbear did with Flatout 2.

 

Zebulon55

ZeBBy
Master Blaster
Hey guys;

I'm just some casual playing guy from the community who thinks Bugbear did a fine job with the game, and continues to provide more enjoyable content. I'm not highly skilled, so a more approachable (easier) game is a good thing, IMHO.
I like the random hazards for their ... randomness. What's a game if you never lose?

Thanks for thoughtfully expressing your feelings about what you perceive to be shortcomings of the Wreckfest game.
It is an unfortunate reality that you can't please everybody all of the time.
Some people will never be pleased. Hope you are not among them.

Just my two cents.

8^)

______________________________________________________________________-
opinion
[əˈpinyən]

NOUN
opinions (plural noun)
  1. a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
    "I'm writing to voice my opinion on an issue of great importance" ·
    [more]
    synonyms:
    belief · judgment · thought(s) · school of thought · thinking · way of thinking · mind · point of view · view · viewpoint · outlook · angle · slant · side · attitude · stance ·
    [more]
    • the beliefs or views of a large number or majority of people about a particular thing.
      "the changing climate of opinion"
    • (opinion of)
      an estimation of the quality or worth of someone or something.
      "I had a higher opinion of myself than I deserved"
    ^_________________________________________________________________^

 

Cegon

Member
Let's not dismiss METE0R's post for isolated points that can be disproven, there are other, valid points in his post that are worth discussing. The reason I didn't comment on how technically rounded or polished the game is just that I personally don't really have a good frame of reference on these things because I don't play that many games to compare. I'd still be interested in seeing other people's opinions on this so let's keep the ball rolling.


I'm not highly skilled, so a more approachable (easier) game is a good thing, IMHO.
I like the random hazards for their ... randomness. What's a game if you never lose?

Thanks for thoughtfully expressing your feelings about what you perceive to be shortcomings of the Wreckfest game.
It is an unfortunate reality that you can't please everybody all of the time.
Some people will never be pleased. Hope you are not among them.
I agree and I don't condemn the addition of chaotic tracks to the game. The server list (I'm from central Europe) clearly shows that about half the playerbase prefers servers that are focused on Deathmatches, Figure 8, Hellride, Crash Canyon etc. I think we can all agree that nobody wants to take these types of tracks and events out of the game.

But, looking at the server list again, let's not forget about the other half of the playerbase who prefers servers that are focused on racing circuits, some even with rules that say semi-clean or clean. All I'm asking for (and most of the time when I say "I" or "me" it represents what the people on my Discord agree upon and would like to see for our own public server that we pay for because we love the game) is that every once in a while, in an update, something is added or changed that shows "our" part of the playerbase, the racers, that we are a valid part of this game as much as the other part of the playerbase, the wreckers.
Maybe a new racing-focused track, or just one of TheVeryEnd's excellent rallycross tracks added as an official track, maybe a rework of a car that is considered OP, or just a little tweak for a car that "fell out of the META".
 

METE0R

Member
How can you say that Wreckfest is at the level of Flatout 1????????

I was there in 2005 when I got my Flatout 1 US version. There was no online for Flatout 1, but there was LAN mode players could use. Euro v1.1 did not have text chat in the lobby. US v1.2 had a 3 line text chat.

It took modders to come up with programs to take Flatout online so players from around the world could race Flatout 1 online. This what the guys at Flatout Joint did tapping into the LAN code:



We added a nice chat window and some host options like random track.




Here what a Flatout 1 US v1.2 host options and lobby look like: ( had get out my Flatout 1 disk to get these 2 pics )





Flatout 1: Only 8 players, only up to 10 laps
Wreckfest: 24 player lobbys, 60 lap race if you want.





Took this pick today:




Things you can do in Wreckfest host options:

Edit server message in real time after you in the lobby, can use colored text
Can do team races and derbys
Can pick the weather
Can turn reset off or up to a 20 sec delay ( I fought for at least a 5 sec delay reset before Bugbear gave us this reset option )
There a reverse limiter for them Clean or semi-Clean servers ( I use to race Flatout 1 clean with bunch of Euro guys, hi Drunkfin )

Things you can do in a Wreckfest lobby.

Can upgrade your car or change the paint on your car skin ( this got added last year )
Can tune your car for the track your on next
Can go to Settings and tweak your steering sensitivity if you going to race with the sofa car ( -50 )
Can scroll the text chat window, if you miss what was posted while you was racing or changing your car
Can add bots to the server, if there not enough real players to have some fun with. Watch out for my evil twin!

Wreckfest server list:

Can now set a server you like, to be a favorite and show at top of list ( yellow star ). Very helpful when there a list of 576 servers!
Or use the Filter to narrow list to only servers with a player in it
Or use the Friends tab, to see what server your friends are in. :)

****************************************************************

So Meteor, I have to strongly disagree with you about comparing current Wreckfest with Flatout 1. Now Flatout 2 online was not bad for back in 2006. But all 3 Flatouts, 1, 2 and UC, we only had 8 players online. We got blown away when Bugbear gave us 18 players online back in Oct 2014 and then got updated to 24 player. :O



I been here since the summer 2012 and when Bugbear said they were working on their "Next Car Game", I did a thread to help Bugbear from doing online badly like we seen other racing games do and improve on what Bugbear did with Flatout 2.

I compare Wreckfest multiplayer with FlatOut for a reason. FlatOut was originally aimed at a career, and multiplayer faded into the background. Wreckfest is not clear on what it is aimed at, because it does not have official dedicated servers from the developers and the career, to put it mildly, smells like beta, and FlatOut turns out to be more ideally made in 2004 than Wreckfest for 2018.
How can you say that Wreckfest is at the level of Flatout 1????????

I was there in 2005 when I got my Flatout 1 US version. There was no online for Flatout 1, but there was LAN mode players could use. Euro v1.1 did not have text chat in the lobby. US v1.2 had a 3 line text chat.

It took modders to come up with programs to take Flatout online so players from around the world could race Flatout 1 online. This what the guys at Flatout Joint did tapping into the LAN code:



We added a nice chat window and some host options like random track.




Here what a Flatout 1 US v1.2 host options and lobby look like: ( had get out my Flatout 1 disk to get these 2 pics )





Flatout 1: Only 8 players, only up to 10 laps
Wreckfest: 24 player lobbys, 60 lap race if you want.





Took this pick today:




Things you can do in Wreckfest host options:

Edit server message in real time after you in the lobby, can use colored text
Can do team races and derbys
Can pick the weather
Can turn reset off or up to a 20 sec delay ( I fought for at least a 5 sec delay reset before Bugbear gave us this reset option )
There a reverse limiter for them Clean or semi-Clean servers ( I use to race Flatout 1 clean with bunch of Euro guys, hi Drunkfin )

Things you can do in a Wreckfest lobby.

Can upgrade your car or change the paint on your car skin ( this got added last year )
Can tune your car for the track your on next
Can go to Settings and tweak your steering sensitivity if you going to race with the sofa car ( -50 )
Can scroll the text chat window, if you miss what was posted while you was racing or changing your car
Can add bots to the server, if there not enough real players to have some fun with. Watch out for my evil twin!

Wreckfest server list:

Can now set a server you like, to be a favorite and show at top of list ( yellow star ). Very helpful when there a list of 576 servers!
Or use the Filter to narrow list to only servers with a player in it
Or use the Friends tab, to see what server your friends are in. :)

****************************************************************

So Meteor, I have to strongly disagree with you about comparing current Wreckfest with Flatout 1. Now Flatout 2 online was not bad for back in 2006. But all 3 Flatouts, 1, 2 and UC, we only had 8 players online. We got blown away when Bugbear gave us 18 players online back in Oct 2014 and then got updated to 24 player. :O



I been here since the summer 2012 and when Bugbear said they were working on their "Next Car Game", I did a thread to help Bugbear from doing online badly like we seen other racing games do and improve on what Bugbear did with Flatout 2.

I compare Wreckfest multiplayer with FlatOut for a reason. FlatOut was originally aimed at a career, and multiplayer faded into the background. Wreckfest is not clear on what it is aimed at, because it does not have official dedicated servers from the developers and the career, to put it mildly, smells like beta, and FlatOut turns out to be more ideally made in 2004 than Wreckfest for 2018.
We can also take, for example, the game Killing Floor 2, it has its own problems and this is a shooter, but it has official servers, and for a second it received a full release in 2016, when Wreckfest was published in 2018, and progress is not worth it, and already every developer making the game sharpened online has a duty to provide new players with official servers. The wreckfest has become in place in this regard, and I'm still silent about the inconvenient change of maps online, when you have to randomly take the desired track, because there is no picture of the selected track on the right, although there is a lot of space to insert this chip there, but it is not so far...
As for the rest, I agree that there are many other different chips that are not in the FlaOut 1 multiplayer, but this is a 2004 game, and at that time it was progressive and unique in its plan and at that time all the possibilities in the game were enough for everyone. It's 2021 now, and Wreckfest doesn't have the stuff that every online game has today.
Well, at the expense of multiplayer you disagree with me, okay, I didn't have enough arguments to convince you that the game is stagnating in this regard. So maybe you agree with me on other points? I think that I lucidly and objectively told about everything, and if you want to discuss with me, brother, I am ready, I am savvy in this regard, and even if I am wrong in something, I will not beat my horns into the ground and admit that I am not right.
 

METE0R

Member
How can you say that Wreckfest is at the level of Flatout 1????????

I was there in 2005 when I got my Flatout 1 US version. There was no online for Flatout 1, but there was LAN mode players could use. Euro v1.1 did not have text chat in the lobby. US v1.2 had a 3 line text chat.

It took modders to come up with programs to take Flatout online so players from around the world could race Flatout 1 online. This what the guys at Flatout Joint did tapping into the LAN code:



We added a nice chat window and some host options like random track.




Here what a Flatout 1 US v1.2 host options and lobby look like: ( had get out my Flatout 1 disk to get these 2 pics )





Flatout 1: Only 8 players, only up to 10 laps
Wreckfest: 24 player lobbys, 60 lap race if you want.





Took this pick today:




Things you can do in Wreckfest host options:

Edit server message in real time after you in the lobby, can use colored text
Can do team races and derbys
Can pick the weather
Can turn reset off or up to a 20 sec delay ( I fought for at least a 5 sec delay reset before Bugbear gave us this reset option )
There a reverse limiter for them Clean or semi-Clean servers ( I use to race Flatout 1 clean with bunch of Euro guys, hi Drunkfin )

Things you can do in a Wreckfest lobby.

Can upgrade your car or change the paint on your car skin ( this got added last year )
Can tune your car for the track your on next
Can go to Settings and tweak your steering sensitivity if you going to race with the sofa car ( -50 )
Can scroll the text chat window, if you miss what was posted while you was racing or changing your car
Can add bots to the server, if there not enough real players to have some fun with. Watch out for my evil twin!

Wreckfest server list:

Can now set a server you like, to be a favorite and show at top of list ( yellow star ). Very helpful when there a list of 576 servers!
Or use the Filter to narrow list to only servers with a player in it
Or use the Friends tab, to see what server your friends are in. :)

****************************************************************

So Meteor, I have to strongly disagree with you about comparing current Wreckfest with Flatout 1. Now Flatout 2 online was not bad for back in 2006. But all 3 Flatouts, 1, 2 and UC, we only had 8 players online. We got blown away when Bugbear gave us 18 players online back in Oct 2014 and then got updated to 24 player. :O



I been here since the summer 2012 and when Bugbear said they were working on their "Next Car Game", I did a thread to help Bugbear from doing online badly like we seen other racing games do and improve on what Bugbear did with Flatout 2.

The last thing I will say is that wreckfest is not popular, and we all know that super-quality products in the gaming industry become classics and last a long time. You can look at the turn-based strategy heroes 3, and you will be surprised but in the 1999 game there is more online than in the 2018 Wreckfest. And you will probably say that these are games of different genre, and you will be absolutely right, but here it is a matter of quality, and Heroes 3 is a branch of quality among turn-based strategies, which means that the developers did not just manage, but even did more. I will not say that Wreckfest is directly degrading, it is still stagnating, but the fact that my ass has started to blaze means that the game is shifting a little bit into the abyss and is in danger of being forgotten.
These are not mere words, the game really runs the risk of being forgotten, because among famous game bloggers this game is nowhere mainstream for the channel. Basically, Forza or Crew becomes the main games for them. Basically, only non-name bloggers have Wreckfest (in terms of known to very few), and this indicates the unpopularity of the game among players who play races.
If it is not popular now, then what about the future? You can keep saying that everything is fine, because you don't know what the crisis of the Russian gaming industry is. They also said that they were doing well until they released the Lada Racing Club, which was the last straw for the players who were waiting for this game. Now when they say that everything is fine with us, then everyone starts laughing in response, because in fact everything is bad with us.
 

METE0R

Member
I'm happy to see someone make a post like this. Often I find myself holding back criticism because I don't want to be seen as the grumpy old man who always finds something to make a fuss about. In reality I'm seriously passionate about Wreckfest and I want the game to be long term succesful.


Tracks

You mentioned long tracks, something like the Nürburgring might be too much since it's about 22 kilometers, I think the upper limit is about 2.5 kilometers to keep the cars closer together on a 24 slot server (Sandstone Main and Alt Route is both roughly 2.5 kilometers each). That being said I 100% agree on longer tracks.

The tracks that have been added recently, most have either one or the other thing in common. One thing is being a simple oval which gets boring after a very short time, the other thing is they induce random crashes (Wrecknado, Eagle's Peak...) because of intersections or multidirectional sections with oncoming traffic. Even Hillstreet Circuit is designed in a way that the leading cars that exit the "loop" at low speed get punted by the cars that enter the "loop" at high speed. The wasted potential of Hillstreet Circuit is that it is missing a variant without the intersection. Otherwise it is a great track and I love how the road surface has reduced grip compared to, let's say, the pristine tarmac of Espedalen Raceway.

Tracks with intersections that induce chaos are great for new players but, from my observation, as soon as a player reaches a certain skill level, that player then prefers calculated punting to benefit their position over random crashing that randomises everyone's position in the race. Long-term players are the ones who buy Season Passes and use their own hardware or money to set up public servers.


Career / Tutorial for new players

Personally I like the idea of incentivising new players to play some form of career mode to have access to more cars, but I completely understand that my opinion is outdated and most players want to jump into multiplayer right away. Something I noticed with this type of player is that they neither understand building a car for the PP cap of a particular class, nor the meaning behind the suspension / gear ratio / differential / brake balance sliders -- and I don't blame them! That stuff is difficult to understand for non-petrolheads.

What if, somewhere in the main menu, there was a text box saying "we have tutorial videos for setting up your car on our official website!" (and matching videos on said website)?


Balance

The Raiden RS sticks out like a sore thumb because it can do ridiculous laptimes while being cartoonishly easy to drive, solid as a rock and also you basically can't spin or push it. The Super Venom is less problematic since the only thing it does exceptionally well is laptimes. Compare both these cars to the Starbeast SS which is brand new but, as of now, even worse than the regular Starbeast because it has peak torque and power higher in the rev range without having, let's say, an extra gear to compensate for it. Anyway, the game needs a re-balance.

If a part of Wreckfest's business model relies on selling DLC cars, those cars should be relevant in multiplayer.


Advertising DLC cars

In the "Market" menu where you buy vehicles, there should be previews for DLC vehicles and a text box that explains how to get them. The Loaner cars players drive during Tournament challenges should be DLC vehicles so players get to see for themselves that the DLCs are worth the money. I'd even go so far to say each DLC vehicle should have a 30 second trailer that shows different paintjobs and armor setups.

Car dealerships sell cars because they have cars on display and they offer test drives.
At the expense of the Nurburgring, this is more of a symbolic wish, but believe that such symbolic additions very often have a positive effect on the popularity of the game, and with good advertising they can attract an audience from competitive projects. This is more likely to be added by modders than developers, but hope dies last :) Cegon, do not try to be comfortable and say if there are problems, because the only hope is for oppositionists like us, and even if we are silent, then the fall of the game will be partly our fault!
All players in this game are needed, both like us and like Purple44, because he is one of those beams of optimism that allows game developers not to lose heart if the game dies, he is the immunity that fights the disease. We are those who are trying to help the body before the immunity has to fight for life. Only together we will be able to make the game better and not fall into the abyss, it deserves a better future than the one in which it is now going.
 

METE0R

Member
Hey guys;

I'm just some casual playing guy from the community who thinks Bugbear did a fine job with the game, and continues to provide more enjoyable content. I'm not highly skilled, so a more approachable (easier) game is a good thing, IMHO.
I like the random hazards for their ... randomness. What's a game if you never lose?

Thanks for thoughtfully expressing your feelings about what you perceive to be shortcomings of the Wreckfest game.
It is an unfortunate reality that you can't please everybody all of the time.
Some people will never be pleased. Hope you are not among them.

Just my two cents.

8^)

______________________________________________________________________-
opinion
[əˈpinyən]

NOUN
opinions (plural noun)
  1. a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
    "I'm writing to voice my opinion on an issue of great importance" ·
    [more]
    synonyms:
    belief · judgment · thought(s) · school of thought · thinking · way of thinking · mind · point of view · view · viewpoint · outlook · angle · slant · side · attitude · stance ·
    [more]
    • the beliefs or views of a large number or majority of people about a particular thing.
      "the changing climate of opinion"
    • (opinion of)
      an estimation of the quality or worth of someone or something.
      "I had a higher opinion of myself than I deserved"
  2. ^_________________________________________________________________^
Do you think that if the bots in the game start playing for a skill, and the eights disappear from the game, then you will win all the time? Listen guy, you're joking well :) Again, an objective opinion is based on the subjective opinions of the majority, and I spoke from the majority that could be in the game, but there are only ardent fans in it who accept the game in whatever form it is, but a quality game should not be limited only to them. And I noticed that the whole group of ardent fans from this game are repeating the same phrase "You can't please everyone."
And I'm not saying that everyone needs to be good, I say that the game needs to be developed, and the players in the game are a guideline that developers can look at if they experience a crisis of ideas and risk adding something that will destroy the game.
In any case, the player has more experience in the game than the developer, and if the player is able to put himself in the place of the game and understand what will be useful for him in this case, and what is harmful.
New content is good, but we have already seen an example in the form of DayZ, where the developers added content at first without solving problems with the technical part of the game, as a result they lost a lot of fans and lost part of their reputation, which they are now restoring very slowly.
 

Cegon

Member
These are not mere words, the game really runs the risk of being forgotten, because among famous game bloggers this game is nowhere mainstream for the channel. Basically, Forza or Crew becomes the main games for them. Basically, only non-name bloggers have Wreckfest (in terms of known to very few), and this indicates the unpopularity of the game among players who play races.
I've been thinking about why they prefer Forza Horizon. From multiplayer footage I know players like to push and punt, but it doesn't really have that much of an effect in Forza. The thing about Forza, the one very big thing besides racing, is customization. It's the same deal with personal cars in GTA Online, they are completely useless (because ground vehicles are slow and cumbersome deathtraps in the current META), 98% of them are useless even for racing-type game modes, and yet players spend all day grinding so they can buy another car to customise wheels, bumpers, aero, paintjob and livery.
Players love to be creative and share their creativity. Lately, Wreckfest has been on the right path when it comes to car customization, but it's still rather limited. One limiting factor is the system of liveries and styles, the other limiting factor is that most cars are irrelevant. For example, earlier I was in several consecutive races where the whole field of nearly 20 players was made up of Razors, Super Venoms, and Raiden RS's (and one lonely Hunter Panther piloted by me).


At the expense of the Nurburgring, this is more of a symbolic wish, but believe that such symbolic additions very often have a positive effect on the popularity of the game, and with good advertising they can attract an audience from competitive projects.
You know what, that actually is a great idea, it'd have to be not quite as massive as the original and it needs to have a name like Blackburg Ring or Black Castle Ring (that's what it translates to) to avoid copyright trouble ;)
 

Purple44

Well-Known Member
Team Bugbear Member
Does this look like Wreckfest is dying? https://steamdb.info/app/228380/graphs/



Does this look like PC Wreckfest online is dying after 2 1\2 years after Final release?? http://wfservertracker.com/

Feb 23, 2021:


Feb 17, 2020:



The peaks you see are Steam sales. Wreckfest is a niche racing game. Either you love it or you don't! I bet new players that go online for the first time and join a no rules server and are DNF in the first lap, either go What the F***, rage quit and get their Steam refund and we never see them again!!!

Or player goes F*** YA this great!!!!!!!! And we find another player that love Wreckfest. :)

I'm very happy that Wreckfest online is doing well and look like it still growing thanks to new Steam sales. Thanks to the dedicated server software, we could still be racing Wreckfest online 10 years from now. There players still racing Flatout 1. :)

**************************************************************
You can't compare Wreckfest game to games like turn-based strategy heroes 3 games. It even tough to compare Wreckfest to racing games. Wreckfest is not an arcade racer like Flatout 2 and it not sim racing game either. Wreckfest is a sim-cade and Bugbear has found the sweet spot. :) GRID 1 2008 version is the only other racing game that I have, that found that sim-cade sweet spot over the years.

If read my Multiplayer Do's and Don'ts. thread, must PC racing games, that are not sims, online die off in 2 to six months. Flatout 2, GRID 1 and now Wreckfest ( 2 1\2 yrs ) has had strong online after 3 years. :)


Purple44 said:
- 12-29-2010 Defintely Stock Flatout 2 has the most players online. Back in 2009 and when Gamespy link still work, on a busy day Gamespy link showed there was over 500 players online racing and derbying with Flatout 2.

Last fall, on a Saturday I counted around 200 players online with stock Flatout and around 100 players using our community mod with carpack3 online.

So it best to keep a stock version of Flatout 2 and a second folder for modded version or use De Stan mod manager to switch between stock and modded versions of Flatout 2.

Ya sure there things that can be improve on, new things to be added, but at this stage in Wreckfest life cycle. will that bring in enough new players to justify the cost and development time? Bugbear not an independent studio any more. Bugbear was brought by THQ and the Devs now work for THQ. And you could say that came about because in the summer of 2014, Bugbear made big decision to over haul the ROMU game engine ( Build #5 and Build #6 ), now that Bugbear was flush with couple millions of $$ thanks to Steam in early 2014.

But it took Bugbear a year to over haul ROMU game engine, got rid a lot of old code ( engine was 14 years old: 2000-2014 ) and had to retweak things to get game engine to play nice again. Feb of 2015, a Dev posted this:



Build #7 final got release in June of 2015, 9 months after release of Build #6. By late 2016, Wreckfest was not ready for final release and Bugbear was running low on cash. Dec 2016, Bugbear down to 15 Devs, from 24 Devs in 2013. Bugbear get an infusion of cash from THQ and get to finish Wreckfest and release PC version in 2018.




So I think Bugbear leery of trying make any major changes to Wreckfest now. Adding Tournament mode was big addition to game. Gave the offline players something new to do. :) And any big things, have get THQ OK these days, I would think.

But how big is this list? From Wreckfest Discord:

RocketMan39™02/21/2021
I don’t think that’s a bug(edited)
[4:06 PM]
It’s done that since release

jannesBB02/21/2021
It has, but it's on our backlog of issues to resolve.

Bugbear still has an overflowing plate of things to do and deal with. like the gamepass issue this last week. Bugbear not just supporting the PC version of WF, there the console versions too. That have their own issues.

*******************************************************************************

But, will there be a Wreckfest 2?? Is Bugbear starting to work on a WF 2 this year? That could expand on players ideas for Wreckfest?

Or is Bugbear ready to start a new "Next Car Game" and develop something else beside an updated Wreckfest? Bugbear been working on "Wreckfest\ NCG" for 9 years now.
 
Last edited:

METE0R

Member
Does this look like Wreckfest is dying? https://steamdb.info/app/228380/graphs/



Does this look like PC Wreckfest online is dying after 2 1\2 years after Final release?? http://wfservertracker.com/

Feb 23, 2021:


Feb 17, 2020:



The peaks you see are Steam sales. Wreckfest is a niche racing game. Either you love it or you don't! I bet new players that go online for the first time and join a no rules server and are DNF in the first lap, either go What the F***, rage quit and get their Steam refund and we never see them again!!!

Or player goes F*** YA this great!!!!!!!! And we find another player that love Wreckfest. :)

I'm very happy that Wreckfest online is doing well and look like it still growing thanks to new Steam sales. Thanks to the dedicated server software, we could still be racing Wreckfest online 10 years from now. There players still racing Flatout 1. :)

**************************************************************
You can't compare Wreckfest game to games like turn-based strategy heroes 3 games. It even tough to compare Wreckfest to racing games. Wreckfest is not an arcade racer like Flatout 2 and it not sim racing game either. Wreckfest is a sim-cade and Bugbear has found the sweet spot. :) GRID 1 2008 version is the only other racing game that I have, that found that sim-cade sweet spot over the years.

If read my Multiplayer Do's and Don'ts. thread, must PC racing games, that are not sims, online die off in 2 to six months. Flatout 2, GRID 1 and now Wreckfest ( 2 1\2 yrs ) has had strong online after 3 years. :)





Ya sure there things that can be improve on, new things to be added, but at this stage in Wreckfest life cycle. will that bring in enough new players to justify the cost and development time? Bugbear not an independent studio any more. Bugbear was brought by THQ and the Devs now work for THQ. And you could say that came about because in the summer of 2014, Bugbear made big decision to over haul the ROMU game engine ( Build #5 and Build #6 ), now that Bugbear was flush with couple millions of $$ thanks to Steam in early 2014.

But it took Bugbear a year to over haul ROMU game engine, got rid a lot of old code ( engine was 14 years old: 2000-2014 ) and had to retweak things to get game engine to play nice again. Feb of 2015, a Dev posted this:



Build #7 final got release in June of 2015, 9 months after release of Build #6. By late 2016, Wreckfest was not ready for final release and Bugbear was running low on cash. Dec 2016, Bugbear down to 15 Devs, from 24 Devs in 2013. Bugbear get an infusion of cash from THQ and get to finish Wreckfest and release PC version in 2018.




So I think Bugbear leery of trying make any major changes to Wreckfest now. Adding Tournament mode was big addition to game. Gave the offline players something new to do. :) And any big things, have get THQ OK these days, I would think.

But how big is this list? From Wreckfest Discord:

RocketMan39™02/21/2021
I don’t think that’s a bug(edited)
[4:06 PM]
It’s done that since release

jannesBB02/21/2021
It has, but it's on our backlog of issues to resolve.

Bugbear still has an overflowing plate of things to do and deal with. like the gamepass issue this last week. Bugbear not just supporting the PC version of WF, there the console versions too. That have their own issues.

*******************************************************************************

But, will there be a Wreckfest 2?? Is Bugbear starting to work on a WF 2 this year? That could expand on players ideas for Wreckfest?

Or is Bugbear ready to start a new "Next Car Game" and develop something else beside an updated Wreckfest? Bugbear been working on "Wreckfest\ NCG" for 9 years now.
Much of course justifies the state of the game at the moment. On the Ru-segment, the game is not at all popular, hence my conclusion that the game is bent. It's like in Europe with consoles and PCs. PCs are dying out in Europe because they prefer consoles. So on the ru-segment it is quite the opposite. You can know one piece of information, and I am completely different. Okay, maybe I got excited about the dying out wreckfest, I admit. It's just that my situation looks from a different angle. And you can compare games of different genres if you compare their common features and performance. I did not compare the genres themselves, they say the shooter is better than racing, or vice versa, I took the online state at the moment. And if you doubt the righteousness of my ideas, suggestions and assumptions, then in vain.
The content is tasteful, because here I agree that you will not please anyone, but despite the fact that at that moment when the game moved towards licked cars and their customization, as well as when the game received minor improvements online, then the number of players who like this game , the beginning of growth. This means that I am very right in my thoughts and suggestions. By the way, here is an example with the choice of a track by voting, everyone asked for it, everyone waited, and everyone was satisfied. So here, too, there are things that will be to everyone's liking, and among them there are those that are relatively easy to develop. I could say just a little of what I think, but I took it upon myself to say everything so that there was a clear idea of the ideal for this game.
I don’t think we need to be careful with the addition of obviously necessary things, given that some things have already been done by the modders.
 

Cegon

Member
Ya sure there things that can be improve on, new things to be added, but at this stage in Wreckfest life cycle. will that bring in enough new players to justify the cost and development time?
I respect the fact that game developement is subject to economic considerations. But one thing that confused me about the last two major updates is -- first, we got snow tracks for Tournament. They all looked and felt thoroughly designed and polished so I assume a lot of time and effort went into creating them. There was predominantly positive feedback and players were looking forward to multiplayer races on snow tracks. Then they got removed.
Are there any plans to make snow tracks available for multiplayer?
Are there any plans to add more fanmade tracks? Some of them are definitely up to par with the official ones.
I'm asking because these tracks already exist so implementing them wouldn't use up too much developement time.

Also, looking at the SteamSpy stats for average and median playtime, these seem rather low (correct me if I'm wrong). Overall, I still get the impression that the main focus is on bringing in new players. Again, I understand that this is a good thing from a conventional business perspective, but online games aren't 100% conventional business. There is a delicate balance between satisfying new players and satisfying the core audience / long time players. New players need long time players to see the possibilities the game has to offer (comparable to low level MMO players looking up to max level fully endgame geared players) and long time players need new players to get a feeling for how far they have progressed (again comparable to MMOs).
 

METE0R

Member
I respect the fact that game developement is subject to economic considerations. But one thing that confused me about the last two major updates is -- first, we got snow tracks for Tournament. They all looked and felt thoroughly designed and polished so I assume a lot of time and effort went into creating them. There was predominantly positive feedback and players were looking forward to multiplayer races on snow tracks. Then they got removed.
Are there any plans to make snow tracks available for multiplayer?
Are there any plans to add more fanmade tracks? Some of them are definitely up to par with the official ones.
I'm asking because these tracks already exist so implementing them wouldn't use up too much developement time.

Also, looking at the SteamSpy stats for average and median playtime, these seem rather low (correct me if I'm wrong). Overall, I still get the impression that the main focus is on bringing in new players. Again, I understand that this is a good thing from a conventional business perspective, but online games aren't 100% conventional business. There is a delicate balance between satisfying new players and satisfying the core audience / long time players. New players need long time players to see the possibilities the game has to offer (comparable to low level MMO players looking up to max level fully endgame geared players) and long time players need new players to get a feeling for how far they have progressed (again comparable to MMOs).
I think a light applause would be appropriate here. And I didn't notice right away, but really 2 hours in the last 2 weeks is not enough for an online project, although this is a breakthrough for the current game since the addition of tournaments to the game. There are things that make players keep playing and make new progress, but these things are not in this game for the average player. For advanced players, here you can take a car faster and try to break records on the tracks, while an ordinary player comes in for clear progress. In the same Killing Floor 2 there is a Dosh storage that is replenished for killing zombies and this is one of the chips that makes the anchor effect (makes the player play the game longer).
For every half a million Dosh, the player receives a container from which he can receive all sorts of goodies from these containers. In wreckfest, you can do something like that, and I must say this will help greatly increase online games.
And in Killing Floor 2, you can get Dosh only by killing zombies, you can't pay for containers and that's good, the work of the players who play is not devalued by the presence of donation and preserves the credibility of the developers.
 

BowtomePhil

New Member
I played flat out years ago loved it. I bought wreckfest a few weeks ago.

I absolutely love every part of it .

My opinion and I will continue to play for now.

Is there a new one in the works because when I bought it there was a small game installed which didn't seem like Wreckfest? Called sneak peak 2.0
 

Purple44

Well-Known Member
Team Bugbear Member
Hi, the sneak peak 2.0 is version 2 of the demo Bugbear release back in Nov 2013. The sneak peak v1.0 and v2.0 went viral on youtube and got the ball rolling big time on selling pre-orders of Next Car Game! :)

v2.0 with over a 1 million views back in Dec 2013:


I only got 1400+ views for my v1 demo video back in Nov 2013:
 
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