Week #3 Report

glodesh

New Member
Weeked Smasher
I don't know if someone already answer to this question yet but i was wondering if the crossfire will be implemented into the build sooner or later or not at all? I have a tri-fire and i can't wait to experiment high frame rate with all gpu enabled. Thanks for answering and sorry for my bad english.
 

Needles Kane

Member
Weeked Smasher
Conte Zero said:
since Guitar Jozz mentioned ramps and heights in general: I still don't see high / long jumps in Wreckfest. Is it a ROMU limitation? Sometimes cars jump or fly fter violent crashes, but overall the game looks like it's avoiding major jumps

I don't think ROMU has any problems with flying or jumping, since there was plenty of that stuff since the first sneak peek, so I ask myself: why the most recent level design guidelines tend to exclude jumps?

Is it just my impression?
It's not engine limitation, propably it's because they aim realistic design of race tracks. I also would like to see some tracks with bigger jumps.
 

UsF

Member
Team Bugbear Member
http://nextcargame.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/blog_post_week_3_pic3.jpg

This picture you posted shows exactly why we need a concurrent damage model, where the car dealing out the damage needs to take the same amount as the one being hit, unless you hit him in a weak spot (which the side certainly is). But the ramming car seems to be at such high speed that the game decided it shouldn't receive any damage at all, which is somewhat sad.

I understand that for the default game mode, it is fine and really great to be dishing out those great hits, but for a more reasonable racing experience, having the instigators take damage as well would force them to take less risks.
 

vogurt

Member
UsF said:
http://nextcargame.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/blog_post_week_3_pic3.jpg

This picture you posted shows exactly why we need a concurrent damage model, where the car dealing out the damage needs to take the same amount as the one being hit, unless you hit him in a weak spot (which the side certainly is). But the ramming car seems to be at such high speed that the game decided it shouldn't receive any damage at all, which is somewhat sad.

I understand that for the default game mode, it is fine and really great to be dishing out those great hits, but for a more reasonable racing experience, having the instigators take damage as well would force them to take less risks.
I agree with this. Even if it's just a little bit more of damage, there needs to be something. I don't want a guy going 80mph to pin someone at the wall and go from 80 - 0 hitting someone and then just driving off with a scratch while the other car is rolled up like an accordion.
 

Lari Fari

Gaming Since 1989
I'm not sure how close to realistic physics calculation the current model works concerning this. But the faster car to take less damage in a crash is actually realistic. I would like the proportions of damage each car takes when having different impact speeds to be aas realistic as possible.

I don't want the crasher to get out with no damage, either. But both taking the same damage even if one stands still and the other ones going 100 kmh, wouldn't feel right aswell.
 

UsF

Member
Team Bugbear Member
Lari Fari said:
I'm not sure how close to realistic physics calculation the current model works concerning this. But the faster car to take less damage in a crash is actually realistic. I would like the proportions of damage each car takes when having different impact speeds to be aas realistic as possible.
Do you have a link or article to back that up (I'd be interested, really :) )? It shouldn't matter I think, because the energy being transferred is the same. It is just that the fast car will slow down while the stationary car will speed up, but the damage from an impact should be about the same, given that the same area of the car is hit. The picture makes some sense, as the stiff muscle car front is hitting the weaker side of the car, thus making it crumble, but it looks like the agitator did not receive any scratch whatsoever, which is unrealistic.

Edit: To back up my statement here
, see a pickup colliding with a sedan in a crash test scenario. The pickup receives just about as much damage, just slightly less, because the sedans crumbling front poses less resistance and therefor absorbs more energy and in turn transfers less back. The pickup is also way heavier, so it forces the other car to move, while also keeping momentum, indicating that it had more weight. At 2:45 is a good angle.
 

St. Jimmy

Finland
Full time wrecker
Jori Virtanen said:
crazychris4124 said:
Oh man you guys should have gave us the option to have this build with the insane physics as a joke.
This has actually been asked of us many times! We do have a Steam beta branch where we test stuff, and we have seriously considered opening it up for people. It's a frightening thing to do, letting people show how broken the product currently is, but it could be so cool, too! We'll see :)
Well at least people would have something more to do between patches if that happens ;D

But it's very understandable to not release very buggy builds and maybe there could slip a feature that you need to take away later.
 

Frisker

Active Member
Weeked Smasher
Yeah, the hitter needs to get damage aswell. Maybe 50-70% from the damage they inflict to another car, so the "victim" would still suffer bit more damage, thus making it somewhat profitable, but it should be risky business.
 

sam223

Active Member
Weeked Smasher
Frisker said:
Yeah, the hitter needs to get damage aswell. Maybe 50-70% from the damage they inflict to another car, so the "victim" would still suffer bit more damage, thus making it somewhat profitable, but it should be risky business.
Its much more than that 85-15% maybe even 90-10%.It depends on the type of impact and position the receiving car is hit. High speed impacts on the rear of stationary cars always cause much more damage to the stationary car. Often the delivering car is simply stuck inside the receiving car and will drive off almost unscathed if they get free.Car + car into stationary object is similar with the front car absorbing momentum from both cars upon impact. Hitting a stationary car headon will cause some damage to the delivering car. Head on impacts where both cars are travelling causes the most damage to both cars.

Damage delivered depends on mass + speed. So realistically speaking the Euro should be out after 1 70mph hit from the sedan, whereas for balancing reasons it can withstand more hits than the much bigger and heavier muscle 2.


Its not an exact science though,just like the moment of inertia on cars. To portray it accurately you would need many complex equations working together simultaneously.
 

Lari Fari

Gaming Since 1989
UsF said:
Lari Fari said:
I'm not sure how close to realistic physics calculation the current model works concerning this. But the faster car to take less damage in a crash is actually realistic. I would like the proportions of damage each car takes when having different impact speeds to be aas realistic as possible.
Do you have a link or article to back that up (I'd be interested, really :) )? It shouldn't matter I think, because the energy being transferred is the same. It is just that the fast car will slow down while the stationary car will speed up, but the damage from an impact should be about the same, given that the same area of the car is hit. The picture makes some sense, as the stiff muscle car front is hitting the weaker side of the car, thus making it crumble, but it looks like the agitator did not receive any scratch whatsoever, which is unrealistic.

Edit: To back up my statement here
, see a pickup colliding with a sedan in a crash test scenario. The pickup receives just about as much damage, just slightly less, because the sedans crumbling front poses less resistance and therefor absorbs more energy and in turn transfers less back. The pickup is also way heavier, so it forces the other car to move, while also keeping momentum, indicating that it had more weight. At 2:45 is a good angle.
To portray it accurately you would need many complex equations working together simultaneously.
I'll try to explain. In the end its down to basic laws of physics. I learned it in school back then. But Thats like 10 years ago so... ;-)

The damage dealt by one moving object to another depends mostly on two things: Energy and Impulse.

Kinetic Energy of a moving object is E = 1/2 m x v2

E = Energy
m = mass (weight) of the object
v = velocity (speed) of the object

This may be enough to understand why the damage is different:

Two variables in this equation can change: mass and velocity.

So a heavier object will have more kinetic Energy than the lighter one. A truck and a car hitting eachother head on at the same speed... well we all know how that would end.

Now if two cars of exact same weight hit eachother, but one is going faster that the other. The faster car will have more kinetic energy than the slower car. Resulting in the slower car taking more damage.

But what actually matters in this is impulse, which is harder to explain. Impulse is the transfer of energy from one object to another. Resulting in a change of momentum.

Luckily I just found a youtube video which explains it... coincidentally using two cars in the example :D

I am currently at work, so I can't check if the video backs up exactly what I said above. But I am pretty sure the result (different damage) will be confirmed. Have fun:

 
J

Jelco

Guest
All i have to say is that i'm exited and i'm hoping for the much needed singleplayer improvements
 

Jori Virtanen

Automatic weapons and boundless love.
Daystar said:
I did bring up the AI issues... as can be located here. http://community.bugbeargames.com/index.php/topic,7105.msg62203.html#msg62203

seems not much will change, but there will be some minor tweaks so I hear :eek:
Well, makes sense to tweak the AI later -- when you know the physics are tweaked right, you know the AI behaves erratically because it's dumb and not because the physics are off mark :) And that's when you can start hammering the AI to form.
 

Rabbit80

Member
Jori Virtanen said:
This has actually been asked of us many times! We do have a Steam beta branch where we test stuff, and we have seriously considered opening it up for people. It's a frightening thing to do, letting people show how broken the product currently is, but it could be so cool, too! We'll see :)
Please do.. At least to those that have bought into the "digital deluxe edition" ;)
 
M

Mopower

Guest
As for the hitting car receiving damage, Sam is right, though it totally depends on the car being hit, the car delivering, the angle, speed, what they're being hit into, etc.
 

Felon454

New Member
This may be totally off topic but a mode like the racing below I think would be awesome with multiplayer. 4 on 4. First team to get 5 laps wins. Basically no rules since its a video game.

This is the kind of Demolition we have here. Its awesome and my family was involved with it for a long time. Not that any of that matters but I think the core idea would work well in a game environment.

 

Frisker

Active Member
Weeked Smasher
Felon454 said:
This may be totally off topic but a mode like the racing below I think would be awesome with multiplayer. 4 on 4. First team to get 5 laps wins. Basically no rules since its a video game.

This is the kind of Demolition we have here. Its awesome and my family was involved with it for a long time. Not that any of that matters but I think the core idea would work well in a game environment.

I love your signature. That beast actually yours? :3 :3 :3
 
M

Mopower

Guest
Felon454 said:
This may be totally off topic but a mode like the racing below I think would be awesome with multiplayer. 4 on 4. First team to get 5 laps wins. Basically no rules since its a video game.

This is the kind of Demolition we have here. Its awesome and my family was involved with it for a long time. Not that any of that matters but I think the core idea would work well in a game environment.

Yup, I've suggested it before as well as a couple others! But hopefully bugbear keeps their interest in it. Lol would be pretty awesome
 
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